Vikings Message Board.Com

CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:53 pm

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 1:42 pm

It's not an assumption about leadership. Case has always been a leader since his days at University of Houston. Cousins isnt. It has always been a knock on him. Think back to his pre-game speech last year. He's not a vocal guy. Again, nice guy but not a guy guys follow.

If Case is such a good leader why are the Skins 0-2? He's leading them into the basement. Maybe that team shouldn't be following him. Make your own path and maybe win a game? A team that can't win a game has a great leader. That doesn't make any sense to me.

halfgiz wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:09 pm Eagles and Dallas are tough teams. Skins D gave up over 30 points in both games.

CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 pm

halfgiz wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:09 pm Eagles and Dallas are tough teams. Skins D gave up over 30 points in both games.

A great leader beats tough teams.

halfgiz wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:09 pm Eagles and Dallas are tough teams. Skins D gave up over 30 points in both games.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:00 pm

halfgiz wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:09 pm Eagles and Dallas are tough teams. Skins D gave up over 30 points in both games.

The eagles aren’t nearly as good as some think. They struggled with Washington and just lost to Detroit. Both at home. And lost to Atlanta who we just took to the cleaners

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:42 pm

CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 pm
A great leader beats tough teams.

So.... Have you seen Kirk's record against winning teams? You don't have a leg to stand on here.

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 1:42 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:12 am

Much of what I said is not wrong at all. We crossed over with the AFC north and NFC south. Case Keenum did not play against the saints. Sam Bradford did. Also, the ravens didn’t even make the playoffs. Case Keenum faced 4 playoff teams in that schedule (panthers, falcons, rams, Steelers) and went 2-2 against them. 4 games out of the 15 he started he played against a playoff team. Last year I believe cousins had 7 playoff teams and 2 packers games with Rodgers. Keenums schedule was the definition of cupcake.

He didn’t play anywhere near as good as Kirk last year. And what, since he’s out performed him in 2 games this year that means he’s worth it? And again, the Atlanta game is a wash. You can’t fault Kirk for throwing 10 times. That game was all about flow and there was no need to pass given how fast we jumped on them.

As for flips offense, it’s QB friendly? Case isn’t a gun slinger that can carry a load on his shoulders. He needs a running game. That showed in 2017. Without Murray and McKinnon, Keenum doesn’t have near the success. Case made plenty of unorthodox lob passes where if he’s throwing 40 times a game in flips offense, he’s bound to make mistake after mistake. Case was beat by 3 of the worst teams in the nfl with Denver. Denver’s defense wasn’t nearly as bad as what it showed last year but Keenum struggled to sustain drives and had his fair share of turnovers. Denver doesn’t have the roster we do but there is no reason they couldn’t have been a 9-7 team at least with a better QB. Flip would have been fired much sooner than week 13 if Keenum was there. Cris carter said it as well. He said if Keenum was their QB they’d be lucky to have 2 wins.

And I guess I’m not sure how you think case is a better leader in the locker room. Like, are you in there? Have you seen reports that cousins isn’t a leader in the locker room. That statement is solely based on assumption. There is no real truth to that

It's not an assumption about leadership. Case has always been a leader since his days at University of Houston. Cousins isnt. It has always been a knock on him. Think back to his pre-game speech last year. He's not a vocal guy. Again, nice guy but not a guy guys follow.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:00 pm

halfgiz wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:09 pm Eagles and Dallas are tough teams. Skins D gave up over 30 points in both games.

The eagles aren’t nearly as good as some think. They struggled with Washington and just lost to Detroit. Both at home. And lost to Atlanta who we just took to the cleaners

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:18 pm

CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:53 pm
If Case is such a good leader why are the Skins 0-2? He's leading them into the basement. Maybe that team shouldn't be following him. Make your own path and maybe win a game? A team that can't win a game has a great leader. That doesn't make any sense to me.

Leadership and team construction are two different things. Let's not pretend we didn't see him galvanized this team in 2017. Regardless of success, he is a better leader than Kirk. Kirk may be a better QB, thats arguable but leadership no way. Case also doesnt fall apart due to pressure. In pressure situations, he tends to raise his game.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:12 pm

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:18 pm

Leadership and team construction are two different things. Let's not pretend we didn't see him galvanized this team in 2017. Regardless of success, he is a better leader than Kirk. Kirk may be a better QB, thats arguable but leadership no way. Case also doesnt fall apart due to pressure. In pressure situations, he tends to raise his game.

This goes along with what I’ve said about cousins. It’s a team game. Every aspect of the team in 2017 was playing well. From the OL to the play calling to the defense. Big Ben and Rodgers have been questioned as leaders and they still have success. It sounds like you’re trying to say cousins lack of leadership is what caused the team to falter last year. I can bet money that wasn’t the case. Case didn’t “galvanize the team”. They were all playing well. Last year, the entire team didn’t play well. And there was a drastic change at OC

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:15 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:12 pm

This goes along with what I’ve said about cousins. It’s a team game. Every aspect of the team in 2017 was playing well. From the OL to the play calling to the defense. Big Ben and Rodgers have been questioned as leaders and they still have success. It sounds like you’re trying to say cousins lack of leadership is what caused the team to falter last year. I can bet money that wasn’t the case. Case didn’t “galvanize the team”. They were all playing well. Last year, the entire team didn’t play well. And there was a drastic change at OC

I am not blaming Cousins for last year. I am not blaming Cousins for the team's performance. I am saying to you guys that Cousins isnt the answer. He is perfectly adequate during smaller games like Oakland. He is a guy when things go wrong, he plays worse. I wish it isnt so.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:06 pm

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 1:42 pm

It's not an assumption about leadership. Case has always been a leader since his days at University of Houston. Cousins isnt. It has always been a knock on him. Think back to his pre-game speech last year. He's not a vocal guy. Again, nice guy but not a guy guys follow.

You’re basing how he is as a leader off of a pregame speech? And what was wrong with his speech? I remember him screaming in the huddle firing everyone up. It all started when griffen went out.

And I don’t recall him not being a leader as a knock on him?

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:39 pm

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:15 pm

I am not blaming Cousins for last year. I am not blaming Cousins for the team's performance. I am saying to you guys that Cousins isnt the answer. He is perfectly adequate during smaller games like Oakland. He is a guy when things go wrong, he plays worse. I wish it isnt so.

And we’re saying Keenum isn’t the answer either. But either way, I’m done discussing a below average QB that is no longer on this team. We won today. I’ll talk about that.

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:46 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:39 pm

And we’re saying Keenum isn’t the answer either. But either way, I’m done discussing a below average QB that is no longer on this team. We won today. I’ll talk about that.

Youre in the wrong thread then. There is a post game thread.

YikesVikes wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:42 pm

CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 pm
A great leader beats tough teams.

So.... Have you seen Kirk's record against winning teams? You don't have a leg to stand on here.