For anyone doubting AD

[84BreaksAnkles]

This is for the people; calling for AD to be traded, saying he is past his prime, thinking he's becoming ineffective.

I'll use our most recent victory, one in which most are complaining about how ineffective he was. As someone pointed out he was hit within 1 yard of the line of scrimmage on 15/18 carries which is 83.3% of the time..

If you think any other back in the league can do these things, with the above circumstances, you are sorely mistaken......


Adrian's strength & speed combination is unparalelled.. To bust of a 75 yarder, then in full momentum to not be forced out by this guy? and put him on the turf, stay in-bounds and keep running???? only AD..







Even when the D-Line crushes our O-Line and gets in the backfield he can do this...


This spin?


How many broken tackles do you want?


No other Back in the league gets 2 yards here...

[IrishViking]

Absolutely no offense intended but what are you trying to accomplish? I would guess to a (wo)man here we have watched every game this year. I could just as easily cherry pick 3 play from the game that make him look like absolute garbage if I wanted to.

It's not a matter of how many times he was hit behind the line. Everyone knows he is a lot. It's a matter of why. There are some here who put more blame on the Oline and some who put more blame on AP. I personally think both are valid and both are true to a certain degree. But one thing needs to be accepted.

He is past his prime, empirically speaking he will average fewer and fewer yards and anything else will be an outlier. Can he still be effective? Yes I believe he can easily be a top 5 back in league for a couple more years. Can he do it in spite of his oline as he as done in several points in his career? He is showing he doesn't have that ability anymore. Which is fine and completely natural, no player should be expected to do that. However he USED to be able to, and now he cant. He is diminishing. He was at a much higher level than almost any other running back ever so his diminished is still elite but its happening. Can we skip the part where every time he breaks a decent run from here on out we dress it up as indisputable proof he will play till he is 40 and break the rushing record?

[84BreaksAnkles]

Absolutely no offense intended but what are you trying to accomplish? I would guess to a (wo)man here we have watched every game this year. I could just as easily cherry pick 3 play from the game that make him look like absolute garbage if I wanted to.

It's not a matter of how many times he was hit behind the line. Everyone knows he is a lot. It's a matter of why. There are some here who put more blame on the Oline and some who put more blame on AP. I personally think both are valid and both are true to a certain degree. But one thing needs to be accepted.

He is past his prime, empirically speaking he will average fewer and fewer yards and anything else will be an outlier. Can he still be effective? Yes I believe he can easily be a top 5 back in league for a couple more years. Can he do it in spite of his oline as he as done in several points in his career? He is showing he doesn't have that ability anymore. Which is fine and completely natural, no player should be expected to do that. However he USED to be able to, and now he cant. He is diminishing. He was at a much higher level than almost any other running back ever so his diminished is still elite but its happening. Can we skip the part where every time he breaks a decent run from here on out we dress it up as indisputable proof he will play till he is 40 and break the rushing record?

This is why I don't take the time to post GIFs anymore..

Duh, hes human, he will slowly diminish over time. He is still elitely effective.

Can we skip the part where every time he breaks a decent run from here on out we dress it up as indisputable proof he will play till he is 40 and break the rushing record?

No one SAID THIS... DON'T PUT WORDS IN PEOPLES' MOUTHS

He is showing he doesn't have that ability anymore.

IS HE? Cause I just posted 4 plays that proves he does have the ABILITY ANYMORE.

It's not a matter of how many times he was hit behind the line.

dude, what planet does this make sense in? YES IT IS-
SURE BLAME A GUY WHO RECIEVES THE FOOTBALL AND HAS TO ALREADY MAKE GUYS MISS TO GET TO THE LINE OF SCRIMMAGE, its his fault for sure..

I could just as easily cherry pick 3 play from the game that make him look like absolute garbage if I wanted to.

THEN DO IT. I know you cannot show me ONE SINGLE PLAY from the Lion's game where he looked like "garbage" (WHERE THE DEFENDERS WEREN'T ALREADY IN THE BACKFIELD WHEN HE RECEIVED THE FOOTBALL..)

Absolutely no offense intended but what are you trying to accomplish?

I'm SHOWING YOU THAT in 4 INCREDIBLE PLAYS, ADRIAN CAN GAIN 103yds, that is not diminishment.

4 plays- 103yds case closed, he is still as dangerous as ever.

We need to figure out how to get a push up front at the point of attack, and fix the run-blitzing problem to solve the problem for the rest of the carries...

[Mothman]

Absolutely no offense intended but what are you trying to accomplish? I would guess to a (wo)man here we have watched every game this year. I could just as easily cherry pick 3 play from the game that make him look like absolute garbage if I wanted to.

It's not a matter of how many times he was hit behind the line. Everyone knows he is a lot. It's a matter of why. There are some here who put more blame on the Oline and some who put more blame on AP. I personally think both are valid and both are true to a certain degree. But one thing needs to be accepted.

He is past his prime, empirically speaking he will average fewer and fewer yards and anything else will be an outlier. Can he still be effective? Yes I believe he can easily be a top 5 back in league for a couple more years. Can he do it in spite of his oline as he as done in several points in his career? He is showing he doesn't have that ability anymore.

You're literally claiming he can't do something he is currently doing.

He is diminishing. He was at a much higher level than almost any other running back ever so his diminished is still elite but its happening. Can we skip the part where every time he breaks a decent run from here on out we dress it up as indisputable proof he will play till he is 40 and break the rushing record?

Please, as you can see from Niko's reaction above, a straw man argument like that just sets people off so what we should actually skip is the refutation of arguments that weren't put forth in the first place.

[DK Sweets]

You're literally claiming he can't do something he is currently doing.

I want to preface this with the statement that every run counts, so we can't just pretend that Adrian isn't getting massive yardage. That said, if you remove one run from his recent games, his YPA is garbage.

Irish, forgive me if I misinterpreted your argument, but I believe your point was that Adrian isn't being a consistent threat in our offense right now. Many times his "go big" mentality is getting him stuffed behind the line, so the blame doesn't fall completely on the o line.

It's hard to say how much of this is because of the attention he gets, but the other two backs have got more consistent yardage than Adrian this far. So while statistically Adrian is getting too-level numbers, play-by-play he isn't looking like a top level runner.

[Funkytown]

Here's something:

Of Adrian Peterson's 120 carries this season, 62 (a little over half) have resulted in 2 yards or fewer.

By contrast, Asiata and McKinnon have 34 combined carries this season, and only 10 have gone for 2 or fewer yards.

[dead_poet]

Here's something:

Compare/contrast number of rush blitzes Asiata/McKinnon have had plus number of times they've been hit at or behind the LOS compared to Peterson. That'd be an interesting exercise.

[J. Kapp 11]

Let me try to give a measured point of view.

I don't see how anybody can say that AP is ineffective. Clearly, the videos show that's not the case.

But I won't say I'm not concerned.

Throw out the extremes. In my mind, those include the 75-yard run, as well as those times he's hit 5 yards behind the LOS. On the 75-yarder, the end (or OLB, I'm not sure) didn't contain the edge, and AP made him pay (and by the way, showed that he still has plenty left ... that jump-cut to the edge ... wow). That won't be the case most plays. And when he's hit in the backfield, that doesn't say anything about AP's ability ... that speaks volumes about the O-line's inability.

Instead, look at the normal runs, those where there's a bit of a seam, but not a gaping hole. Where he gets through the first level, and he's one-on-one with a linebacker or safety. More often than not, he's being brought down. And not only is he being brought down, he's giving up his momentum, either juking or trying to make a cut, or something. Those are the plays that concern me.

In his prime, he'd get to that second level with the momentum of a freight train. Now he seems ever so tentative, and he's getting stopped. In Weeks 2 and 3, that wasn't the case. But the past two games, I'm seeing a lack of aggression that I've never really seen from AP. He's not punishing tacklers.

Now in his defense, we don't know what kinds of injuries he's battling. That has to be a factor.

To summarize, all I'm saying is that AP doesn't look as good as he once did. I am NOT saying he's ineffective. But he is 30 years old. All those times he's delivered punishment to tacklers, he's also absorbed it. It's not a slap in APs face to say the tires may be a little worn, even if they still have rubber left.

[fiestavike]

Compare/contrast number of rush blitzes Asiata/McKinnon have had plus number of times they've been hit at or behind the LOS compared to Peterson. That'd be an interesting exercise.

I think there is a degree to which Peterson contributes to his number of short runs, but putting aside the runs outta the gun, its somewhere around 85-90 percent on the offensive line by my estimation.

[84BreaksAnkles]

I apologize to IrishVike for overreacting in anger.
But I still want him to provide some sort of evidence for what I feel are preposterous statements.

[sneaxsneax]

I will take the ineffective argument here because I actually believe that is largley what he is.

I dont care that he ripped 1 huge run off, he will probably do that a few more times this year. But for the overall offense? I'd rather a guy who gets his yards more consistently, I'd rather a guy get 3-4 yards on 20 carries than a guy that carries it 19 times for 9 yards and 1 yard for 70 because our offense is not going to function well when our running game is constantly stifled. If that 1 huge run results in a TD, so what? I'd rather an offense that can move the ball and score multiple times.

We got lucky in that Teddy was great on 3rd and long, yesterday could have been terrible., I'd rather have a running back who can help us on every drive. I'd rather have a guy that can help us on every set of downs instead of putting us in 2nd and 12 to start every set of downs. I'd rather a guy that can block. We don't need to hit homeruns we need to move the ball with a balanced attack. We can find running backs that can do that, we might have the winning combination for that kind of running on our offense (much like we did last year without AP).

[IrishViking]

Sorry if I upset anyone.


First. I am not going to post plays. If your argument is that I cannot find 3-5 plays where he looks "Bad" from this season then I don't know what to tell you. I could find 5 plays that makes Rodgers look bad from this year. I don't think its a reasonable argument to say "I wont count general knowledge unless its presented to me"

Second, as was alluded to above my point is simply he isn't 24 year old AP anymore and that he forces it sometimes. Yes the oline is bad. Again I wont post videos here (For the same reason above, the body of evidence is so massive I considers requests to prove it simply delaying tactics) but AP has a known historical tendency to push and be impatient. The Coaches have talked about it, HE'S talked about it. Its a fact.

Third, I think the characterization of me making a straw man argument is unfair. Because there was no argument to counter. If this had been a simple gif post with a "check these plays out" type comment, I would have gladly chimed in with awe. Instead this is a combative post "calling out" people who didn't "believe" in AP. and I think I posted my thoughts in a respectful manner. I am sorry if you feel very forcefully that AP is still the AP of yore. But I don't and that is the ONLY point I made apart from general commentary on the state of the "Debate"

I would be thrilled to see a comparison of the Asiata/Mc touches compared to AP. It does seem like (with a small sample size) our ground game moves a bit better without AP in there. At some point I would think they need to do a value comparison of AP taking pressure off the passing game vs the actual production of the passing game/running game. I wouldn't say bench him for a game to test the A/Mc tandem because I still think AP is the best option. I personally believe the drop off isn't as big as we would believe though.


I do sincerely apologize if I upset anyone I wasn't trying to bait or troll, just expressing my opinion and frustration. If I came off as rude or dismissive I do, again, apologize.

[Mothman]

I will take the ineffective argument here because I actually believe that is largley what he is.

I dont care that he ripped 1 huge run off, he will probably do that a few more times this year. But for the overall offense? I'd rather a guy who gets his yards more consistently, I'd rather a guy get 3-4 yards on 20 carries than a guy that carries it 19 times for 9 yards and 1 yard for 70 because our offense is not going to function well when our running game is constantly stifled. If that 1 huge run results in a TD, so what? I'd rather an offense that can move the ball and score multiple times.

That literally just happened in the game yesterday. They scored on 7 different possessions.

They threw for almost 150 yards off play action yesterday. Those opportunities were there because the Lions were working so hard to stop Peterson. People need to stop focusing on the few runs McKinnon or Asiata make when the defense isn't keying it's resources on stopping the run and see the bigger picture. Peterson may be getting stuffed as defenses commit extra resources to stopping him but he's still making big plays and his presence helps create big plays elsewhere.

By the way, a huge run resulting in a TD can be the difference between winning and losing. It's not something that should be casually dismissed.

We got lucky in that Teddy was great on 3rd and long, yesterday could have been terrible. I'd rather have a running back who can help us on every drive.

They have one: Adrian Peterson.

[dead_poet]

That literally just happened in the game yesterday. They scored on 7 different possessions.

They threw for almost 150 yards off play action yesterday. Those opportunities were there because the Lions were working so hard to stop Peterson. People need to stop focusing on the few runs McKinnon or Asiata make when the defense isn't keying it's resources on stopping the run and see the bigger picture. Peterson may be getting stuffed as defenses commit extra resources to stopping him but he's still making big plays and his presence helps create big plays elsewhere.

By the way, a huge run resulting in a TD can be the difference between winning and losing. It's not something that should be casually dismissed.
They have one: Adrian Peterson.

Great post.

[akvikingsfan]

AD still has big play potential. But with that said, his production is not what it was before. Yes, he hits one or two big runs every game, but outside of that he does little to nothing to help the offense. When a back is averaging under two yards a carry and every other carry goes for a loss he is not helping the team. I know the argument that the opposing defenses are run blitzing when he is in, and that is true. However, in the past he was able to beat these run blitzes more often, he was able to fall forward for a few yards almost every time, and single tacklers didn't bring him down. A lot of it is on the offensive line. But AD is not what he was in the past. He is past his prime.

The other backs are not better, but they are more helpful to this offense. The two other backs are able to pick up a couple yards every carry and not regularly put the team in second and long or third and long situations. If the offensive line was of any use, this argument may not even be taking place. But with the way things are right now, AD's running style, and being past his prime I really don't have as much value for him as I did in the past. I believe the offense would perform better with the other two backs getting more carries.

With all of that said, I am still a fan of AD and if he were to spend the rest of his career playing in purple I'd be okay with that. In the other thread where I brought up trading him, I was doing so to point out that I believe the team can be successful without him and that if we are able to get something of value in return we should go for it. Beyond that, I hope AD is able to get back on track and perform like all of us have come to expect of him over the years. In my opinion, one big run a week, although it may look good on the stat line, is not what this offense needs to be successful.