Eagles pre game thread!

[Dmizzle0]

Man I'm extra fired up now. Zach Brown is talking smack on Cousins, saying that he is the weakest part of the offense. I really hope he will prove him wrong and goes for 400+ yards on that D.

Skol!

[CharVike]

Regardless, he’s had the eagles number for the most part. Since becoming a starter in 2015, his record is 5-2 against the eagles. The only 2 losses he’s had were in 2017 (probably the worst Washington team he was one) and it was the year Philly won the SB

Don't bother with stats, PHP. Stats lie.

Plus, he's has stated the consensus.

I said stats can be misleading. You state I said stats lie. Big difference. Maybe this example will help you understand misleading better. If we are getting beat 80-0 late in the game and Cousins throws 5 TD passes in the last three minutes that looks like a dam good stat in the box score. The stat isn't a lie but it is misleading. Our opponent was happy to give up the 5 TDs because they got the win. Consensus means generally accepted opinion. For Cousins that's a loser. He can't beat good teams. That has been hashed to death already.

[808vikingsfan]

So, this is an important game for Cousins, because it does appear that running the ball could be difficult. If he can continue what he did vs Giants, then we should win.

What exactly did Cousins do against the Giants? Imo, he still looked shaky when pressured, bailing out of the pocket too early, was indecisive even when he did have time, late on throws a few times to open receivers. I don't think he took one shot downfield at all. He did have a few intermediate throws that were really nice. That one to Thielen on the right sideline was a beauty. But I doubt PHI will give him as much time, allow him to be clean on bootlegs, or give up as much YAC on screens as NY did. He's going to have to make quick decisive decisions, make the right decisions, take care of the ball, and don't panic.

- The Eagles have a very good, very active front 7 that rotates guys well and stays fresh throughout an entire game. They are the best in the NFL against the run so far this year by quite a bit, and also can get pressure on the QB. In fact, in terms of their front 7, they look like they are better than the Bears defense, at least statistically. This is the kind of defensive front 7 that the Vikings under Kirk Cousins have classically struggled against, both to maintain offensive balance as it is difficult to establish a ground game, and also to protect the QB in passing situations. So this is going to be a real test of whether the Vikings offense has found effective ways to counter that sort of pressure, or whether they are going to wilt again as they did against the Bears two weeks ago.

This is really points 1, 2 and 3. Last week Kirk had ample time to throw due to going up against a very poor front 7 (and secondary). Against tough defensive lines, the entire offense is kneecapped due to one of the worst offensive lines in the league. Kline, who has been surprisingly decent, missed practice today with a foot injury. I have zero faith in our interior line against the Eagles, and thus Kirk Cousins and the entire offense. We're lucky we're at home, but I think the difference in quality of the trenches is too great. I fear a repeat of the Chicago game and will be pleasantly thrilled if I'm wrong.

Which may not be such a bad thing. Better execution on 1 or 2 plays vs CHI and it would have been a different game.

I know this sounds crazy but I actually think the Eagles line forcing Cousins to react faster might be a good thing. If he actually reacts faster, of course. Sometimes he gets into his own head it seems. Perhaps he'll be more decisive because he has to be.

I agree. When he's decisive, he's effective. I've said it before, if Cousins doesn't react within the first 2.5 sec, bad things usually happen.

We need to continue the roll outs with Cousins this game. If we have him sitting in the pocket with this interior DL vs our interior OL, he's going to get killed and have zero time to throw. Especially if he's dropping back from under center. I would hope our OC isnt that dumb to do that.

Disagree. It only worked vs Giants because the Giants. Like the Bears, the Eagles will be waiting for Cousins to roll out. He needs to make quicker decisions in the pocket. Adjust in the pocket to buy time, step up in the pocket with confidence. Help his OL out.

I like our chances ... but I'm far from overconfident. Cousins HAS to come through with an efficient game and no turnovers.

Man I'm extra fired up now. Zach Brown is talking smack on Cousins, saying that he is the weakest part of the offense. I really hope he will prove him wrong and goes for 400+ yards on that D.Skol!

I think what Brown is also saying is that the Vikings have a really good team and Cousins and his performances are what's holding this team back. Hard to argue with that. He certainly wasn't the reason the Vikings won vs ATL, OAK, and NY. You could argue that a better performance vs GB and CHI could have resulted in wins. IMO, Cousins is the crutch of this team. But he is what he is. He won't turn into a mobile QB that can extend plays, or make the big play a few times a game. He's not the type of QB that is so good that it give the team a bigger margin of error. He won't become this clutch player that can carry a team, and will a team to victory. What the Vikings need from him at the very least is good consistent QB play. Just be an average NFL starter, take care of the ball, hit the open man downfield and the Vikings should be competitive in every game.

[Pondering Her Percy]

So, this is an important game for Cousins, because it does appear that running the ball could be difficult. If he can continue what he did vs Giants, then we should win.

What exactly did Cousins do against the Giants? Imo, he still looked shaky when pressured, bailing out of the pocket too early, was indecisive even when he did have time, late on throws a few times to open receivers. I don't think he took one shot downfield at all. He did have a few intermediate throws that were really nice. That one to Thielen on the right sideline was a beauty. But I doubt PHI will give him as much time, allow him to be clean on bootlegs, or give up as much YAC on screens as NY did. He's going to have to make quick decisive decisions, make the right decisions, take care of the ball, and don't panic.

This is really points 1, 2 and 3. Last week Kirk had ample time to throw due to going up against a very poor front 7 (and secondary). Against tough defensive lines, the entire offense is kneecapped due to one of the worst offensive lines in the league. Kline, who has been surprisingly decent, missed practice today with a foot injury. I have zero faith in our interior line against the Eagles, and thus Kirk Cousins and the entire offense. We're lucky we're at home, but I think the difference in quality of the trenches is too great. I fear a repeat of the Chicago game and will be pleasantly thrilled if I'm wrong.

Which may not be such a bad thing. Better execution on 1 or 2 plays vs CHI and it would have been a different game.

I know this sounds crazy but I actually think the Eagles line forcing Cousins to react faster might be a good thing. If he actually reacts faster, of course. Sometimes he gets into his own head it seems. Perhaps he'll be more decisive because he has to be.

I agree. When he's decisive, he's effective. I've said it before, if Cousins doesn't react within the first 2.5 sec, bad things usually happen.

We need to continue the roll outs with Cousins this game. If we have him sitting in the pocket with this interior DL vs our interior OL, he's going to get killed and have zero time to throw. Especially if he's dropping back from under center. I would hope our OC isnt that dumb to do that.

Disagree. It only worked vs Giants because the Giants. Like the Bears, the Eagles will be waiting for Cousins to roll out. He needs to make quicker decisions in the pocket. Adjust in the pocket to buy time, step up in the pocket with confidence. Help his OL out.

I like our chances ... but I'm far from overconfident. Cousins HAS to come through with an efficient game and no turnovers.

Man I'm extra fired up now. Zach Brown is talking smack on Cousins, saying that he is the weakest part of the offense. I really hope he will prove him wrong and goes for 400+ yards on that D.Skol!

I think what Brown is also saying is that the Vikings have a really good team and Cousins and his performances are what's holding this team back. Hard to argue with that. He certainly wasn't the reason the Vikings won vs ATL, OAK, and NY. You could argue that a better performance vs GB and CHI could have resulted in wins. IMO, Cousins is the crutch of this team. But he is what he is. He won't turn into a mobile QB that can extend plays, or make the big play a few times a game. He's not the type of QB that is so good that it give the team a bigger margin of error. He won't become this clutch player that can carry a team, and will a team to victory. What the Vikings need from him at the very least is good consistent QB play. Just be an average NFL starter, take care of the ball, hit the open man downfield and the Vikings should be competitive in every game.

Help his OL out? How about the OL helps him out? Especially the interior. You’re acting like he has all this time and that his interior is playing well. They are part of the problem. Bradbury and Elflein have been dominated. And if you think staying in the pocket and him making quicker decisions this week while Bradbury gets dominated by fletcher cox, then I don’t know what to tell you. This goes both ways, cousins needs to play better in his own way but so does this interior. They are suppose to be the anchor of the “pocket” that’s there or lack there of. I think that’s a big reason they roll out cousins so much. One because they can’t break this under center non stop game plan but also that his interior hasn’t held up. It goes both ways

[J. Kapp 11]

Don't bother with stats, PHP. Stats lie.

Plus, he's has stated the consensus.

I said stats can be misleading. You state I said stats lie. Big difference. Maybe this example will help you understand misleading better. If we are getting beat 80-0 late in the game and Cousins throws 5 TD passes in the last three minutes that looks like a dam good stat in the box score. The stat isn't a lie but it is misleading. Our opponent was happy to give up the 5 TDs because they got the win. Consensus means generally accepted opinion. For Cousins that's a loser. He can't beat good teams. That has been hashed to death already.

Let me be crystal clear about something.

I don't need your help understanding anything. Anything. Got it?

[J. Kapp 11]

Man I'm extra fired up now. Zach Brown is talking smack on Cousins, saying that he is the weakest part of the offense. I really hope he will prove him wrong and goes for 400+ yards on that D.

Skol!

Funny, but Cousins (I believe) is 5-2 against the Eagles.

Maybe Brown needs to just shut his pie hole. Especially coming into our house.

[808vikingsfan]

What exactly did Cousins do against the Giants? Imo, he still looked shaky when pressured, bailing out of the pocket too early, was indecisive even when he did have time, late on throws a few times to open receivers. I don't think he took one shot downfield at all. He did have a few intermediate throws that were really nice. That one to Thielen on the right sideline was a beauty. But I doubt PHI will give him as much time, allow him to be clean on bootlegs, or give up as much YAC on screens as NY did. He's going to have to make quick decisive decisions, make the right decisions, take care of the ball, and don't panic.



Which may not be such a bad thing. Better execution on 1 or 2 plays vs CHI and it would have been a different game.


I agree. When he's decisive, he's effective. I've said it before, if Cousins doesn't react within the first 2.5 sec, bad things usually happen.


Disagree. It only worked vs Giants because the Giants. Like the Bears, the Eagles will be waiting for Cousins to roll out. He needs to make quicker decisions in the pocket. Adjust in the pocket to buy time, step up in the pocket with confidence. Help his OL out.




I think what Brown is also saying is that the Vikings have a really good team and Cousins and his performances are what's holding this team back. Hard to argue with that. He certainly wasn't the reason the Vikings won vs ATL, OAK, and NY. You could argue that a better performance vs GB and CHI could have resulted in wins. IMO, Cousins is the crutch of this team. But he is what he is. He won't turn into a mobile QB that can extend plays, or make the big play a few times a game. He's not the type of QB that is so good that it give the team a bigger margin of error. He won't become this clutch player that can carry a team, and will a team to victory. What the Vikings need from him at the very least is good consistent QB play. Just be an average NFL starter, take care of the ball, hit the open man downfield and the Vikings should be competitive in every game.

Help his OL out? How about the OL helps him out? Especially the interior. You’re acting like he has all this time and that his interior is playing well. They are part of the problem. Bradbury and Elflein have been dominated. And if you think staying in the pocket and him making quicker decisions this week while Bradbury gets dominated by fletcher cox, then I don’t know what to tell you. This goes both ways, cousins needs to play better in his own way but so does this interior. They are suppose to be the anchor of the “pocket” that’s there or lack there of. I think that’s a big reason they roll out cousins so much. One because they can’t break this under center non stop game plan but also that his interior hasn’t held up. It goes both ways

Yes. Help his OL out. Make quicker decisions. Adjust in the pocket. You make it sound like the Vikings have the worst OL in the league. They're about average in pass protection but probably above average in run blocking.

You do know that Cousins has the most time to throw than any other QB in the league. This is not a stat, it's a measurement.

[CharVike]

Help his OL out? How about the OL helps him out? Especially the interior. You’re acting like he has all this time and that his interior is playing well. They are part of the problem. Bradbury and Elflein have been dominated. And if you think staying in the pocket and him making quicker decisions this week while Bradbury gets dominated by fletcher cox, then I don’t know what to tell you. This goes both ways, cousins needs to play better in his own way but so does this interior. They are suppose to be the anchor of the “pocket” that’s there or lack there of. I think that’s a big reason they roll out cousins so much. One because they can’t break this under center non stop game plan but also that his interior hasn’t held up. It goes both ways

Yes. Help his OL out. Make quicker decisions. Adjust in the pocket. You make it sound like the Vikings have the worst OL in the league. They're about average in pass protection but probably above average in run blocking.

You do know that Cousins has the most time to throw than any other QB in the league. This is not a stat, it's a measurement.

I've read some reviews and Elf and Bradberry don't get much praise. Kline has been banged up and won't play Sunday. We could have problems up the middle. Or it might be fine. The Eagles can't generate much pressure. That's a plus in our favor. Being home is another positive. Cousins should have time which helps any QB. IMO this game will come down to our D more than the O. They need to control Wentz. They need to get after this guy. I'm also concerned about Rhodes coverage and that TE.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Help his OL out? How about the OL helps him out? Especially the interior. You’re acting like he has all this time and that his interior is playing well. They are part of the problem. Bradbury and Elflein have been dominated. And if you think staying in the pocket and him making quicker decisions this week while Bradbury gets dominated by fletcher cox, then I don’t know what to tell you. This goes both ways, cousins needs to play better in his own way but so does this interior. They are suppose to be the anchor of the “pocket” that’s there or lack there of. I think that’s a big reason they roll out cousins so much. One because they can’t break this under center non stop game plan but also that his interior hasn’t held up. It goes both ways

Yes. Help his OL out. Make quicker decisions. Adjust in the pocket. You make it sound like the Vikings have the worst OL in the league. They're about average in pass protection but probably above average in run blocking.

You do know that Cousins has the most time to throw than any other QB in the league. This is not a stat, it's a measurement.

Cousins is also under center more than any other QB in the nfl. I’m sure he also rolls out more than any other QB as well. Stump tries to use the same stat. And another reason why I think it’s a flawed stat is because if he has the “most time to throw” that would mean that our offensive line is one of the best if not the best pass blocking OL in the nfl. And we aren’t even close. Nor is this OL average in pass blocking. They are below average. PFF will tell you that as well. I’m not sure when or how our offensive line all of the sudden became average at pass blocking

[808vikingsfan]

Yes. Help his OL out. Make quicker decisions. Adjust in the pocket. You make it sound like the Vikings have the worst OL in the league. They're about average in pass protection but probably above average in run blocking.

You do know that Cousins has the most time to throw than any other QB in the league. This is not a stat, it's a measurement.

Cousins is also under center more than any other QB in the nfl. I’m sure he also rolls out more than any other QB as well. Stump tries to use the same stat. And another reason why I think it’s a flawed stat is because if he has the “most time to throw” that would mean that our offensive line is one of the best if not the best pass blocking OL in the nfl. And we aren’t even close. Nor is this OL average in pass blocking. They are below average. PFF will tell you that as well. I’m not sure when or how our offensive line all of the sudden became average at pass blocking

It's not a stat. It's a measurement. On passing plays, he has (or takes) the most time between the snap and the throw. It does not mean the OL is the best. All it means is he averages over 3 seconds to throw on every passing play, the most by any NFL qb. Whatever he's doing between the snap and the throw (rolling out , dropping back, ), he has more time than any other QB. He may roll out a lot, but I'm sure he's not scrambling like Mahomes or Wilson either.

[StumpHunter]

Yes. Help his OL out. Make quicker decisions. Adjust in the pocket. You make it sound like the Vikings have the worst OL in the league. They're about average in pass protection but probably above average in run blocking.

You do know that Cousins has the most time to throw than any other QB in the league. This is not a stat, it's a measurement.

Cousins is also under center more than any other QB in the nfl. I’m sure he also rolls out more than any other QB as well. Stump tries to use the same stat. And another reason why I think it’s a flawed stat is because if he has the “most time to throw” that would mean that our offensive line is one of the best if not the best pass blocking OL in the nfl. And we aren’t even close. Nor is this OL average in pass blocking. They are below average. PFF will tell you that as well. I’m not sure when or how our offensive line all of the sudden became average at pass blocking

He takes the most time to throw. That is indisputable. Not because of roll outs or scrambling, in the Bears game he had the 2nd longest time in the pocket of any QB, but because he takes a long time to make his reads. He has not seen the field well at all this season, and is getting pressured a lot because of it.

PFF grades very negatively based on pressures allowed, which makes sense until you realize a pressure on a pass completed for 40 yards and a TD is graded the same as a pressure that causes the QB to dump it off for 3 yards. Or a pressure that occurs almost immediately after the snap is graded the same as one 3.5 seconds after the snap. So if Bradbury holds his block long enough for his QB to drop back, make a couple of reads and throws he will be graded better than if his QB instead drops backs, makes a couple of reads and holds the ball.

[CharVike]

Cousins is also under center more than any other QB in the nfl. I’m sure he also rolls out more than any other QB as well. Stump tries to use the same stat. And another reason why I think it’s a flawed stat is because if he has the “most time to throw” that would mean that our offensive line is one of the best if not the best pass blocking OL in the nfl. And we aren’t even close. Nor is this OL average in pass blocking. They are below average. PFF will tell you that as well. I’m not sure when or how our offensive line all of the sudden became average at pass blocking

It's not a stat. It's a measurement. On passing plays, he has (or takes) the most time between the snap and the throw. It does not mean the OL is the best. All it means is he averages over 3 seconds to throw on every passing play, the most by any NFL qb. Whatever he's doing between the snap and the throw (rolling out , dropping back, ), he has more time than any other QB. He may roll out a lot, but I'm sure he's not scrambling like Mahomes or Wilson either.

I'll go old school and look at sacks. Mariota has been sacked the most with 22. Was that caused by the OL or holding the ball too long. According to PFF projection, or guess, the OL is ranked 4th best. So the OL is dam good. But he holds the ball too long. If he hits FA don't sign him. Watson is next with 18. IMO he's a franchise QB so that line must be terrible. They are ranked 27th. Our OL is ranked 25th which isn't very good but our QB has only been sacked 11 times and he holds the ball too long. That makes no sense at all. Our stiff is better than Watson when it comes to sacks. And our OL are about the same ranking. The Eagles OL is ranked no 1 and Wentz has been sacked only 6 times. That makes sense. Wilson has been sacked 13 times and the OL is ranked 23. Better OL than ours and has been sacked more than Cousins. Plus he can move. He must hold the ball too long also. Or he can't make a decision quick enough.

[Bowhunting Viking]

Halftime and looking pretty good so far