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Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 12:48 pm
by dead_poet
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:34 pm
by StumpHunter
VikingLord wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 12:09 pm
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 8:53 am
He was my favorite QB outside of Tua, and I would have taken him at 25 if I were in charge of the draft.
It could be he sucks, but at least one GM really liked him. Probably more than one since the Packers didn't feel he would last until their pick.
I mean really liked him. They have one of the best QBs of our time for at least a few more years and they traded up in the first for Love, knowing Rodgers is probably going to be really pissed about that pick. You don't do that unless you are 100% sold on a QB as a prospect.
This is just my opinion and I could be very wrong about Love as a QB, but based on how much I liked Love, passing on him to have him go to a team they play twice a year is far worse than any first round bust, failing to get your pick in on time or anything else the Vikings have done in the draft.
The Packer trade up to grab Love was an *objectively* bad move IMHO.
Love was not falling. He was not highly rated. This isn't like when Rodgers and Smith were both considered possible #1 picks and then Rodgers fell for no good reason after Smith was picked #1. That was a pure fall with a lot of teams ignoring a very good QB prospect way past the point where he should have gone.
Nobody drafting ahead of the Packers in the 1st round was going to draft Love and nobody was going to trade up into those picks to draft him either. Love might turn out to be a great QB, but no way did he justify what the Packers gave up to get him where they got him.
Further, does this move help the Packers win? The Packers went to the NFC Championship Game and won the North. They're ready to win now. How does drafting a QB of the future (and a reach at that) help them this coming season?
This is the sort of move a bad GM makes absent some incredible inside information. Someone in the Packer organization fell in love with Love and convinced himself he had to move to get him. Delusional IMHO. Love would likely have lasted into at least the mid-2nd, and if anything the Packers could have traded down into the early 2nd, gotten extra picks, and still got him if that is who they really wanted ala what Spielman did with Gladney.
Honestly, a move like the one the Packers just made makes me appreciate Spielman more.
It was not a move that helps them in the immediate future, there is no question about that. Drafting a good WR in that spot would have instantly upgraded their offense for instance.
It might help them in 2023 when Rodgers is traded for a 2nd and Love comes in and gives them 15 more years of great QB play. Or maybe it never works out and just creates a rift between GB management and Rodgers that can never be repaired. I am really hoping for that last one. I can't stomach the former.
I will also add that I will never fault a GM for moving up to get his QB. Hoping a franchise QB falls to you instead of going up and getting him is a bad move. Tennessee might have been looking at Love as someone who was more of a long term prospect than Tannehill, and who knows, maybe they heard the Bears were trying to work out a deal to move up into the 1st to get Love, and the Packers desperately didn't want their division rival to get their QBOTF.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:43 pm
by RandyMoss84
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:34 pm
VikingLord wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 12:09 pm
The Packer trade up to grab Love was an *objectively* bad move IMHO.
Love was not falling. He was not highly rated. This isn't like when Rodgers and Smith were both considered possible #1 picks and then Rodgers fell for no good reason after Smith was picked #1. That was a pure fall with a lot of teams ignoring a very good QB prospect way past the point where he should have gone.
Nobody drafting ahead of the Packers in the 1st round was going to draft Love and nobody was going to trade up into those picks to draft him either. Love might turn out to be a great QB, but no way did he justify what the Packers gave up to get him where they got him.
Further, does this move help the Packers win? The Packers went to the NFC Championship Game and won the North. They're ready to win now. How does drafting a QB of the future (and a reach at that) help them this coming season?
This is the sort of move a bad GM makes absent some incredible inside information. Someone in the Packer organization fell in love with Love and convinced himself he had to move to get him. Delusional IMHO. Love would likely have lasted into at least the mid-2nd, and if anything the Packers could have traded down into the early 2nd, gotten extra picks, and still got him if that is who they really wanted ala what Spielman did with Gladney.
Honestly, a move like the one the Packers just made makes me appreciate Spielman more.
It was not a move that helps them in the immediate future, there is no question about that. Drafting a good WR in that spot would have instantly upgraded their offense for instance.
It might help them in 2023 when Rodgers is traded for a 2nd and Love comes in and gives them 15 more years of great QB play. Or maybe it never works out and just creates a rift between GB management and Rodgers that can never be repaired. I am really hoping for that last one. I can't stomach the former.
I will also add that I will never fault a GM for moving up to get his QB. Hoping a franchise QB falls to you instead of going up and getting him is a bad move. Tennessee might have been looking at Love as someone who was more of a long term prospect than Tannehill, and who knows, maybe they heard the Bears were trying to work out a deal to move up into the 1st to get Love, and the Packers desperately didn't want their division rival to get their QBOTF.
Why would the Bears do that? Bears just traded for Foles
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 2:11 pm
by VikingsVictorious
It was incredibly stupid and somewhat funny.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 2:34 pm
by RandyMoss84
VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 2:11 pm
It was incredibly stupid and somewhat funny.
Jeff and “Jeff”erson
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:02 pm
by VikingLord
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:34 pm
I will also add that I will never fault a GM for moving up to get his QB. Hoping a franchise QB falls to you instead of going up and getting him is a bad move. Tennessee might have been looking at Love as someone who was more of a long term prospect than Tannehill, and who knows, maybe they heard the Bears were trying to work out a deal to move up into the 1st to get Love, and the Packers desperately didn't want their division rival to get their QBOTF.
I won't hold it against a GM to move up to get an objective franchise QB either.
I will hold it against a GM who moves up on the basis of filling in a lot of the blanks in an otherwise sparse picture who, based on that, gets a guy who has a lot of objective question marks.
I am a little curious why you liked Love so much. He has some nice physical attributes, but I felt he needed another year in college to show some evolution in his in-game awareness. I had Love pegged as a late 3rd or 4th round prospect based on what I saw of him, and if I had my pick of Love, Eason or Fromm, I'd take Fromm. He won't wow with his arm or ability to run, but he processes the field like you want your QB to do and would fit in nicely on a team that has a well-balanced offensive attack.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:22 pm
by S197
The Packers took Love despite having Rodgers. The Patriots took Brissett AND Jimmy G despite having Tom Brady. Smart GMs plan for the future and for contingencies. Rick is really poor in this area ESPECIALLY at the QB position.
I'm not saying he needed to trade up and draft in the 1st. I'm saying at some point you should be looking for competition for Cousins. He doesn't draft competition. Ever. Oh wait, I'm sorry there was that one time over a decade ago with John David Booty....
There's absolutely no excuse this draft with this many picks. He needs to get this done and stop relying on journeymen and UDFA's as his backup plan.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:33 pm
by fiestavike
I wanted to hear some of the particular details of your mock drafts.
Sorry I wasn't more clear.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:37 pm
by fiestavike
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:34 pm
VikingLord wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 12:09 pm
The Packer trade up to grab Love was an *objectively* bad move IMHO.
Love was not falling. He was not highly rated. This isn't like when Rodgers and Smith were both considered possible #1 picks and then Rodgers fell for no good reason after Smith was picked #1. That was a pure fall with a lot of teams ignoring a very good QB prospect way past the point where he should have gone.
Nobody drafting ahead of the Packers in the 1st round was going to draft Love and nobody was going to trade up into those picks to draft him either. Love might turn out to be a great QB, but no way did he justify what the Packers gave up to get him where they got him.
Further, does this move help the Packers win? The Packers went to the NFC Championship Game and won the North. They're ready to win now. How does drafting a QB of the future (and a reach at that) help them this coming season?
This is the sort of move a bad GM makes absent some incredible inside information. Someone in the Packer organization fell in love with Love and convinced himself he had to move to get him. Delusional IMHO. Love would likely have lasted into at least the mid-2nd, and if anything the Packers could have traded down into the early 2nd, gotten extra picks, and still got him if that is who they really wanted ala what Spielman did with Gladney.
Honestly, a move like the one the Packers just made makes me appreciate Spielman more.
It was not a move that helps them in the immediate future, there is no question about that. Drafting a good WR in that spot would have instantly upgraded their offense for instance.
It might help them in 2023 when Rodgers is traded for a 2nd and Love comes in and gives them 15 more years of great QB play. Or maybe it never works out and just creates a rift between GB management and Rodgers that can never be repaired. I am really hoping for that last one. I can't stomach the former.
I will also add that I will never fault a GM for moving up to get his QB. Hoping a franchise QB falls to you instead of going up and getting him is a bad move. Tennessee might have been looking at Love as someone who was more of a long term prospect than Tannehill, and who knows, maybe they heard the Bears were trying to work out a deal to move up into the 1st to get Love, and the Packers desperately didn't want their division rival to get their QBOTF.
After Rodgers got McCarthy fired, I think part of this pick was LaFleur making a bit of a power play. This is not Aaron Rodgers' team, It's LaFleur's and if Rodgers thinks Matt is going to be his lap dog, let's remove any hint of that dynamic.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:43 pm
by Rhodes Closed
Imagine if the Vikings manage to draft Winfield and Trevon Diggs.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:29 pm
by VikingsVictorious
fiestavike wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:33 pm
I wanted to hear some of the particular details of your mock drafts.
Sorry I wasn't more clear.
I did a few. They were always better. I will do one and post it just for you.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:32 pm
by RandyMoss84
Rhodes Closed wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:43 pm
Imagine if the Vikings manage to draft Winfield and Trevon Diggs.
I do not want Diggs, the complaining and whining would be out of this world if they do and I do not want to hear that
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:36 pm
by VikingsVictorious
First try. I think it went well. This is assuming we trade for Williams.
MIN 22.
Justin Jefferson
WR LSU
MIN 31.
Jeff Gladney
CB TCU
MIN 58.
Ross Blacklock
DT TCU
MIN 89.
Jalen Hurts
QB Oklahoma
MIN 105.
Robert Hunt
OT Louisiana
MIN 117.
Tyler Johnson
WR Minnesota
MIN 132.
Kenny Robinson
S XFL (West Virginia)
MIN 155.
Trevis Gipson
DE Tulsa
MIN 176.
Reggie Robinson
CB Tulsa
MIN 201.
Saahdiq Charles
OT LSU
MIN 205.
Geno Stone
S Iowa
MIN 219.
Trey Adams
OT Washington
MIN 249.
Carter Coughlin
OLB Minnesota
MIN 253.
Derrek Tuszka
DE North Dakota State
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:39 pm
by VikingsVictorious
S197 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:22 pm
The Packers took Love despite having Rodgers. The Patriots took Brissett AND Jimmy G despite having Tom Brady. Smart GMs plan for the future and for contingencies. Rick is really poor in this area ESPECIALLY at the QB position.
I'm not saying he needed to trade up and draft in the 1st. I'm saying at some point you should be looking for competition for Cousins. He doesn't draft competition. Ever. Oh wait, I'm sorry there was that one time over a decade ago with John David Booty....
There's absolutely no excuse this draft with this many picks. He needs to get this done and stop relying on journeymen and UDFA's as his backup plan.
In this case I totally agree with you. We have so many picks we can afford to use one on a QB. I just did a simulation with us taking Hurts at 89.
Re: Draft thread
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:45 pm
by Rhodes Closed
RandyMoss84 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:32 pm
Rhodes Closed wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:43 pm
Imagine if the Vikings manage to draft Winfield and Trevon Diggs.
I do not want Diggs, the complaining and whining would be out of this world if they do and I do not want to hear that
And you know he'd be like his brother how?