Vikings Message Board.Com

Mothman wrote: ... and if Seattle had decline to trade or traded their pick to someone else and Bridgewater had gone to Houston or another team? Not so masterful. Rick Spielman played a risky game last night and I give him a tremendous amount of credit for what he was able to pull off but it was risky.

If you want the best fruit, sometimes you have to go out on a limb to get it. Or at least that's what my Dad use to tell me.

From what I've read, Zimmer really likes Barr's abilities and Turner likes what he sees in Bridgewater. Until I see otherwise, I'll take their words for it.

It's always seemed to me that the entire business of drafting is one big risk. We never know how many of these players can play in the pro league, regardless how they played college ball.

losperros wrote:If you want the best fruit, sometimes you have to go out on a limb to get it. Or at least that's what my Dad use to tell me.

I like that saying and it's actually a much more succinct way to express what I've been struggling to say. Thanks, Craig!

From what I've read, Zimmer really likes Barr's abilities and Turner likes what he sees in Bridgewater. Until I see otherwise, I'll take their words for it.

I'm happy to do so and I like both picks. From what I heard on NFLN this morning, Zimmer's enthusiasm for Barr is basically the reason the Vikings selected him at #9. Apparently, Manziel was being discussed but they ended up feeling that Barr was just too talented to pass up.

It's always seemed to me that the entire business of drafting is one big risk. We never know how many of these players can play in the pro league, regardless how they played college ball.

It IS one big risk. The draft is filled with difficult decisions. So far, I like what the Vikes have done and with a good third round tonight, the Vikes could be well on their way to a great draft. Let's hope so anyway...

Mothman wrote: Exactly. I think that's a kinder way to say the same thing.

In other words, I'm not really being critical of the team here so much as questioning their conviction regarding these QBs.
The latter is clearly true but in the end, they're still going to end up with a LOT riding on their choice of QB here which is why I find the approach so intriguing.

Are you pleased with our first round, overall, Moth?

I personally was a bit bothered initially by the Barr pick, but I think part of that disappointment/ WTF quality was due to my desire to address the QB position. Once they did that by trading up to 32 I was much more pleased with the night's proceedings. I think we improved our team at two VERY important positions--positions that we had serious needs for improvement.

I hope we can get some secondary help tonight.

Texas Vike wrote:Are you pleased with our first round, overall, Moth?

Yes, very pleased! I actually love what they were able to accomplish. I think Bridgewater is a good prospect with an excellent chance to succeed and Barr has been extremely productive for a player who hasn't been playing defense long. He's clearly an outstanding talent so hopefully, with coaching and development, he'll be an impact player for the Vikings defense for years to come.

I personally was a bit bothered initially by the Barr pick, but I think part of that disappointment/ WTF quality was due to my desire to address the QB position. Once they did that by trading up to 32 I was much more pleased with the night's proceedings. I think we improved our team at two VERY important positions--positions that we had serious needs for improvement.

I hope we can get some secondary help tonight.

I'm hoping for that, more help at LB or a guard but basically, I just want them to get good players.

I'm glad you're feeling good about the first round too.

Personally, I was a bit disappointed how the first round unfolded. I was hoping the Vikes would have traded back to the middle of the first round, Picked up an additional 2nd and 4th and held steady and picked a lot of very solid players through the meat of this deep draft.
The Barr pick surprised me mostly because he doesn't fit the defense that we have all become accustomed to. I don't doubt his physical talent but his experience. But I will defer to Zimmer and am looking forward to seeing some very different schemes on Defense.
We might not do so bad in our first few games because no one will know what is coming. And that's exciting.
As far as the Brifgewater pick, Again I was a bit shocked at the pick, but not that Speilman traded back into the round. I am officially calling him "first round Ricky" from now on. I text my son at 15th pick and predicted that he would get back into the back half of the round. However, I expected them to take their best corner on the board at that point.
My feelings on Bridgewater are mixed. His numbers are encouraging, especially against the blitz. If he does bulk up, I hope it is his lower body and core. Upper body lifting and bulking can easily through off his arm motion and accuracy. Ask any baseball/tennis player. Seems like a great kid. My only other concern is his being quiet. I really hope he commands a huddle and inspires those around him.

I would have liked them to pick Mett in the third if he had lasted that long. I never really wanted JFB because of the media circus that follows. I had enough of that with Favre.

The trade with Cleveland, I think it was basically them getting us on the phone and saying, "Hey we want Gilbert and we don't want Detroit to jump us (many analysts had Gilbert to the Lions) so we'll throw you a pick for the security." To which we replied, "yeah that's fine, we want Barr, so you grab Gilbert and we'll take your 5th." Exact same thing happened with Kalil/Richardson.

As for picking a QB at #8, I think it's clear that no one had anyone besides Bortles rated very high. The cost to move up early in the 1st round is very steep, look at what it cost Buffalo, they have no 1st next year plus they lost another pick this year and they were already drafting at #9. So I think the Vikings had several QBs in mind but most were in the second tier and therefore not worth the #8 pick. However, as the board unfolded basically everyone was available and at that point you see more value in going after a tier two player. As the 20's roll around you try to get back in but you get beat out by Cleveland, and you really can't blame them, hard to compete when the other team still has a 1st. Somewhere in these talks Seattle was willing to drop down 8 spots for a 4th round pick. So essentially for a 4th you get your pick of the rest of the litter PLUS the extra contract year for taking the guy in the 1st. I think that was a great bargain.

And that's what this was, a bargain deal. I think if the Vikings saw a can't miss type guy they would have grabbed him at #8 or made a much stronger play to get back into the 1st. Throwing someone a 4th was essentially a "if you take it cool, but if you don't we're okay waiting" type of deal. A lot of people here thought the Vikings would trade back into the 1st for a QB so I don't really see the surprise.

Texas Vike wrote:I personally was a bit bothered initially by the Barr pick, but I think part of that disappointment/ WTF quality was due to my desire to address the QB position. Once they did that by trading up to 32 I was much more pleased with the night's proceedings. I think we improved our team at two VERY important positions--positions that we had serious needs for improvement.

I know what you mean about Barr. I wasn't even aware that he was so high on the Vikings draft radar, so the pick took me by surprise. I think it's the *surprise* factor that got to me, not me believing the kid can't play.

Regarding Bridgewater, I guess I don't really care about his poor performance day showing, since it's happened to other players that ended up being good in the NFL. From what I've seen of the kid, he's a physically gifted and smart QB and a good leader. I still believe the Vikings need a QB that can truly own the position. I hope Teddy can be that guy.

S197 wrote:The trade with Cleveland, I think it was basically them getting us on the phone and saying, "Hey we want Gilbert and we don't want Detroit to jump us (many analysts had Gilbert to the Lions) so we'll throw you a pick for the security." To which we replied, "yeah that's fine, we want Barr, so you grab Gilbert and we'll take your 5th." Exact same thing happened with Kalil/Richardson.

As for picking a QB at #8, I think it's clear that no one had anyone besides Bortles rated very high. The cost to move up early in the 1st round is very steep, look at what it cost Buffalo, they have no 1st next year plus they lost another pick this year and they were already drafting at #9. So I think the Vikings had several QBs in mind but most were in the second tier and therefore not worth the #8 pick. However, as the board unfolded basically everyone was available and at that point you see more value in going after a tier two player. As the 20's roll around you try to get back in but you get beat out by Cleveland, and you really can't blame them, hard to compete when the other team still has a 1st. Somewhere in these talks Seattle was willing to drop down 8 spots for a 4th round pick. So essentially for a 4th you get your pick of the rest of the litter PLUS the extra contract year for taking the guy in the 1st. I think that was a great bargain.

And that's what this was, a bargain deal. I think if the Vikings saw a can't miss type guy they would have grabbed him at #8 or made a much stronger play to get back into the 1st. Throwing someone a 4th was essentially a "if you take it cool, but if you don't we're okay waiting" type of deal. A lot of people here thought the Vikings would trade back into the 1st for a QB so I don't really see the surprise.

Agree with a lot of what you're saying. I just wanted to add that I think they DID get their "can't miss guy" at #9, and that's the point. Barr was that guy. I think they put Manziel and Teddy slightly ahead of some of those 2nd tier QB's but were comfortable likely missing out on them by taking Barr with the first. Once Manziel and Bridgewater slipped to #22 it was time to make an effort to try and get in there. Knowing they liked both QB's as 1A and 1B, they don't sell the farm to beat the browns at #22 and ultimately fork over a 4th to swap with Seattle. If Bridgewater wasn't a step above Carr / Garappolo / others they wouldn't have much reason to trade into #32 so I believe it when they say they really liked him and I'm glad they made the trade up to make sure we get him.

Call it luck if you want but it worked out almost too good to be true imo!

Mothman wrote:
I'm hoping for that, more help at LB or a guard but basically, I just want them to get good players.

I'm glad you're feeling good about the first round too.

mondry wrote:Call it luck if you want but it worked out almost too good to be true imo!

I do think there was a little luck involved but there was obviously a strategy at work too and in the end, I agree, it worked out well. Hopefully, we'll be looking back on this draft and the last few as the drafts that helped the Vikes build a champion.

I was hoping for Manziel and have some vague misgivings around Teddy for some reason. I really hope he can stabalize the position for a decade. Love the pickup of Barr.

On a side note: I'm on a little B.C. tour and had no intention of looking at the draft until later this month....wasn't really thinking about it. Anyway, a portion of my dream last night (a bit embarrassing) was the Vikings first game this year. Cassel and the rookie (didn't know yet it was TB) both got knocked out in the 1st qtr....Ponder had to come in.


Thought I should just post that here to jinx it so it doesn't come true.

Enjoy the rest of the draft~

When I heard the news this morning I laughed. Clowning Cleveland (again) and essentially using that value (OK, it's a fourth, not the fifth) to get a star level prospect at QB.

wow.....really.....who named this thread???

GBFavreFan wrote:Because QB was the biggest need by far, the pick of Anthony Barr, while addressing a need, neglected THE need. So if we ended up with AJ McCarron or some Norv Turner development guy, then to me, the Barr pick is a waste. But to get Teddy Bridgewater AND Barr, that #8 pick is completely justified, and shows while using #8 on Teddy would still have been a good move, we got such tremendous value overall nabbing Teddy AND Barr.

We have two Top Ten prospects and addressed our two biggest needs by only giving up a 4th. Can a draft go any better in a 1st round?

What's great is Teddy didn't fall into our laps like how Dix and Eddie Lacy fell into the Packers' laps, Spielman had to make a move to get Teddy and show some guts, and he also had to risk using #8 on a defender in case our top QBs were gone by the 2nd round.

Of course this doesn't guarantee performance for these two, but we got the #2 LB in the draft, and up until Pro Day the #1 quarterback, all in day one, and and that was only armed with only the #8 pick in a year where several teams needed a QB.

Why the hell is it a good thing that we had to trade up to get Bridgewater? Its certainly not a bad thing, its just, I don't see why you find it preferable to give up an extra pick, rather then have him slip to us like Lacy did with the Packers.

Purpnation wrote: Why the hell is it a good thing that we had to trade up to get Bridgewater? Its certainly not a bad thing, its just, I don't see why you find it preferable to give up an extra pick, rather then have him slip to us like Lacy did with the Packers.

Qb's don't often slip like RB's lol. One could argue TB already slipped pretty far as well. The texans with no QB on their roster and TB sitting there at the very next pick? Doubt they pass on him.