I think everyone is overreacting a bit

[The Breeze]

[Just Me]

Cassel was the "savior" for the 0-4 Vikes and the great hope to do what Ponder couldn't do. In a one week span, the dynamic changed COMPLETELY. Cassel was suddenly the lame duck QB keeping the seat warm for new guy Josh Freeman. Yeah the season is "over" but have faith my friend, these Vikings aren't finished, just give 'em a few weeks and we'll get a better idea what our future is.

I'm not saying I disagree with the majority of your post, but I don't think it's as simple as "the team rallied positively around Cassel." (my paraphrase). Heck I was as "cautiously optimistic" as anyone when I saw a quarterback who can throw the ball with some speed and is decisive in making the throws. I had no illusions that Cassel would be our future (he's not) but I did have a glimmer of hope that maybe we could go .500 or better for the remainder of the season with him at the helm.

The part that was nagging me (and I posted as much at the time) is that arguably the best offensive display of the season (140 yards rushing/QB 123.4 passer rating) still netted us a close victory in that the Steelers (not exactly a juggernaut) had a chance to tie at the end of the game. I was concerned then (and still) that even a "good offense" cannot continually sustain those kind of numbers, and yet our defense seems to require it for us to be victorious. Our "worst CB" had two interceptions a year ago, (hyperbole alert>>>>>) and now he has had only two plays where he is within 10 yards of the receiver when he is burnt. Ok. Robinson has been better than that, but not by much.

Our best CB was cut (due to financial reasons - and I'm not even saying this was the wrong move) but the guy that couldn't even make the final roster in Seattle, would instantly improve our defense. That is how bad our defense is. I'm not trying to be negative for the sake of being negative. I'm even willing to pretend that Freeman might live up to his original "billing" and become our franchise quarterback, but it won't matter until we fix the defense. I think a last minute stop to prevent a tie against a winless team that has run roughshod over you for much of the game could as easily be chalked up to "dumb luck" as it could be "rallying around the QB."

If Freeman gets his start, I hope we can give him at least the remainder of the season to work through his "growing pains" (and he's going to have them). I want to know at season's end if Freeman is worth keeping around, or if he is just Cassel/Ponder V 2.0

[DanAS]

Yeah we got our butts kicked in a humiliating game, but the truth is we are in a holding pattern right now as we are in a QB limbo like Neo in the white subway of the Matrix. We are in week 2 of an unofficial Ponder era finishing and have not yet begun our new guy in Josh Freeman. We are in a state of transition, a ship without a wheel, and I'm not even that mad at Cassel as they sort of pulled the rug out from underneath him mere days after he was being carried on people's shoulders. There's a lot going on in Viking camp these days not even mentioning Adrian's situation.

Now if this was Ponder continuing to start then we should all call for heads, because that would show that no changes were made. But the biggest and most needed change of all was made and that was removing Ponder from the field. But its not going to happen overnight, and guess what, Josh Freeman might struggle too, but we have the talent to turn things around. My point is I don't think its accurate to judge this team's future on games during this transition period. While one could point out that the defense's performance has nothing to do with an offense's performance, while technically that is true, we are a team and everything affects everything as has been shown in sports for decades.

Good point that giving up on Ponder was one extremely bright spot in an otherwise dark week. Sure it's a transition period. The problem, however, is that Purple Nation is recognizing just how long this transitional period will have to last. There are many, many holes in this piece of Swiss cheese.

If you want another analogy, think about a golfer who cant control his ball. If he only hooks it, he can correct for that, and if he only slices it, he can correct for that, but when he has no clue if he's hooking or slicing, that's depressing. And right now, we have tons of holes on the O and tons of holes on the D. How do you plug the leak when the holes are coming from all over the boat?

OK. That's all the metaphors I'm good for -- but this team has become more like a metaphor for a football team than an actual football team, and until that changes, or at least until one of our units becomes strong, the natives will be understandably restless. Darn -- I guess I had one more metaphor in me after all.

[Mothman]

Good point that giving up on Ponder was one extremely bright spot in an otherwise dark week.

Maybe it was a mistake. They just had their worst offensive performance of the season. If Ponder had started, they would have won that game!

[Just Me]

Maybe it was a mistake. They just had their worst offensive performance of the season. If Ponder had started, they would have won that game!

[Raptorman]

Until the Defense can stop the other team from scoring 30+ points a game it won't matter who the QB is. Ponder, Cassel or Freeman are not good enough to beat teams on a regular basis when they score 30+ against the Vikings.

[Mothman]

LOL!

[Webbfann]

I agree with your premise regarding Cassel and the rug-pull, and have been saying the same thing myself. I also agree we have a lot of talent on the team, and I have not given up on the players (at least offense). I wish I could see anything encouraging from our coaching staff though. They do the same thing over and over and over and it doesn't work over and over and over. The coaches simply aren't giving us winning game strategies. We came out good, throwing the ball and moving the chains. One mistake and Musgrave turtled back into his trademark 3 yard passing game instead of going right back after them. We played conservatively at home where we should play aggressively. Our coaching sucks. Our approach to the game sucks.

Yeah we got our butts kicked in a humiliating game, but the truth is we are in a holding pattern right now as we are in a QB limbo like Neo in the white subway of the Matrix. We are in week 2 of an unofficial Ponder era finishing and have not yet begun our new guy in Josh Freeman. We are in a state of transition, a ship without a wheel, and I'm not even that mad at Cassel as they sort of pulled the rug out from underneath him mere days after he was being carried on people's shoulders. There's a lot going on in Viking camp these days not even mentioning Adrian's situation.

Now if this was Ponder continuing to start then we should all call for heads, because that would show that no changes were made. But the biggest and most needed change of all was made and that was removing Ponder from the field. But its not going to happen overnight, and guess what, Josh Freeman might struggle too, but we have the talent to turn things around. My point is I don't think its accurate to judge this team's future on games during this transition period. While one could point out that the defense's performance has nothing to do with an offense's performance, while technically that is true, we are a team and everything affects everything as has been shown in sports for decades.

[PurpleKoolaid]

Yeah we got our butts kicked in a humiliating game, but the truth is we are in a holding pattern right now as we are in a QB limbo like Neo in the white subway of the Matrix. We are in week 2 of an unofficial Ponder era finishing and have not yet begun our new guy in Josh Freeman. We are in a state of transition, a ship without a wheel, and I'm not even that mad at Cassel as they sort of pulled the rug out from underneath him mere days after he was being carried on people's shoulders. There's a lot going on in Viking camp these days not even mentioning Adrian's situation.

Now if this was Ponder continuing to start then we should all call for heads, because that would show that no changes were made. But the biggest and most needed change of all was made and that was removing Ponder from the field. But its not going to happen overnight, and guess what, Josh Freeman might struggle too, but we have the talent to turn things around. My point is I don't think its accurate to judge this team's future on games during this transition period. While one could point out that the defense's performance has nothing to do with an offense's performance, while technically that is true, we are a team and everything affects everything as has been shown in sports for decades.

Is this some kind of a joke or an attempt for attention? Ponder is done. He has been replaced, get over it. Cassel has played 2 games, and Freeman will be starting next week most likely. None of it matters until the D gets its head out of its as$ anyways. Wait till then for the Ponder crap to start again please.

[King James]

After looking at some things with this team, we could be overreacting. I think the bar was set too high for this team this season. Though we went 10-6 last season, we never were really a 10-6 team. We were just fortunate to have a great year from Peterson and even Ponder started off good by not turning over the ball.

There's a lot of young guys on this team especially on D. Look at our corners, none of them have over 4 years of experience. Our safety none of them have over 5 years of experience. Most of our LBs are young. The only PROVEN vet LB on our team is Chad Greenway. We two other vets in Erin Henderson and Marvin Mitchell but they are still rookies to me in the terms of adjusting to the starting role. Bishop would have been key but he's out for the season.

Basically what im saying is, this team has never left rebuilding mode. We obviously have guys who need to get better but it wont happen over the week. We just have to keep hoping that these young guys are atleast progressing during this struggling season.

[S197]

Yeah we got our butts kicked in a humiliating game, but the truth is we are in a holding pattern right now as we are in a QB limbo like Neo in the white subway of the Matrix. We are in week 2 of an unofficial Ponder era finishing and have not yet begun our new guy in Josh Freeman. We are in a state of transition, a ship without a wheel, and I'm not even that mad at Cassel as they sort of pulled the rug out from underneath him mere days after he was being carried on people's shoulders. There's a lot going on in Viking camp these days not even mentioning Adrian's situation.

Now if this was Ponder continuing to start then we should all call for heads, because that would show that no changes were made. But the biggest and most needed change of all was made and that was removing Ponder from the field. But its not going to happen overnight, and guess what, Josh Freeman might struggle too, but we have the talent to turn things around. My point is I don't think its accurate to judge this team's future on games during this transition period. While one could point out that the defense's performance has nothing to do with an offense's performance, while technically that is true, we are a team and everything affects everything as has been shown in sports for decades.

Thing is, there's a difference between growing pains and just flat out pain. I think what we're seeing is the latter. You should expect some bumps in the road during a transition, rebuild, whatever term you want to use but there are some things that are simply not acceptable. It's not acceptable to have a pass defense rank in the basement of the NFL. It's not acceptable for a team to come out unprepared and get blown out for the third straight year after a bye. It's not acceptable to see the same personnel packages when a player is clearly underperforming. It's not acceptable to see offensive formations that stubbornly stick to the system rather than adapt to the personnel.

You may see it differently, which is fine, but the reason I personally am calling for heads is because this right now is far beyond a little growing pains it's a total failure of leadership.

[King James]

I think that's what it all boils down to. 2011 we were 3-13, 2012 we were 10-6, and 2013 we're metaphorically 3-13. I think what defines what side of the fence you're in with the Vikings is you either believe that 2012 was a sign of how good the Vikings actually are, or you feel the planets aligned for one special season and we completely overachieved. I'm on the side that believes we are underachieving in 2013.

I believe we miss Percy Harvin because he was a big part of our offense before his injury. He was Ponder's go to WR. He could take those 1-2 yard passes and turn them into big gains. Not to mention defense still has to worry about Peterson so we had a lot of mismatches. We no longer have Harvin and I don't know how they plan on using Patterson (assuming that he's Harvin's replacement.)

Same with the D, I think Winfield was that important piece on the team that also led us to being successful. He may have lost a step but was one of the best tacklers on our team.

So I don't think we are underachieving in my opinion. We are playing exactly how many thought we were going to play last season. Nothing is getting handed to us this season though. We don't have Harvin to bail our passing game or Winfield to lead the D. We need a new gameplan

[Funkytown]

'Retired' CB Winfield draws interest from several NFL contenders

- http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jas ... contenders

And that's from today? Nice. Good for him. I wouldn't hate seeing him play again, even if it was for someone else.

[Reignman]

I know I must be mentioning something already said but in mentioning Winfield:

'Retired' CB Winfield draws interest from several NFL contenders

- http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jas ... contenders

Injuries are starting to add up around the league and now Winfield has his pick of contenders that might need his services. Nobody accused Winfield of being a dummy. I will if he rejoins the Vikings xD.

[DanAS]

For me its like this. Get in your time machines and go back to December 31, 2012. We just finished 4-0 in 2012 with this roster, with only Antoine Winfield the only guy that's not here anymore. Imagine if we entered the playoffs with that 2012 roster, but replace Christian Ponder with Matt Cassel and pull Greg Jennings (and his 120+ yards 2 TDs) and Desmond Bishop off the Packers roster, bring him to ours, then fix Jerome Simpson's back. On top of that add Cordarrelle Patterson, Shariff Floyd, and Xavier Rhodes. And then realize we only need to score 25 points to win. Admit it, you'd feel pretty good about those odds right?

I acknowledge that the 2013 Vikings "suck", but I don't think you need to blow the team up or feel there are tons of holes to fix. I believe we have the talent, but something is wrong because the same guys are not playing as well as they did last year. And when you have that situation it is basically the coaches fault, but I don't think they should be fired at this point, I think they are making a major change (QB) and once that position is righted, I feel the chemistry of the team will balance out, confidence will increase in areas, and the team can get back in gear. And if it doesn't get back in gear, then I would think that coaching from top to bottom is the issue, but I do feel we have the talent, but we can always add more, and folks like Cook/Robinson seem to be regressing.

But I'm not sweating this season because I believe we have the talent on our roster. Think about it, we have three guys (Adrian, Felton, Walsh) that are basically the best at their position, plus several that have legit potential to possibly be the best (Harrison, Rudolph, Patterson). And if I have a team that either has talent issues or coaching issues, the coaching issue is easiest and quickest to fix.

The coaching staff will clearly be replaced at the end of the year. But I do believe that the talent isn't good enough either. The clearest problems are all over the place -- QB, OL, secondary, and linebacker. Our DL will be paper thin as well after Allen leaves, and I question whether it will be any good. And the WRs aren't stellar, unless you somehow pencil Patterson in for greatness despite the fact that he isn't doing anything as a pro to show it (other than as a returner).

When you think about it, we excel most at the positions -- RB and KR -- that are least important in today's NFL. It's a passing league, and we're weakest in terms of passing and stopping the pass. And I'm not just talking about coaching; I'm talking about talent.

So yes, a good coach will make a difference, but in terms of being a legit contender, we need a talent upgrade.

Finally, using 2012 as a point of comparison is difficult because (a) AD was running out of his mind, and (b) we were very, very fortunate in the injury department relative to other teams (especially when you realize that Harvin is always injured so his injury was pretty much a given). The uber-healthy teams always have inflated records. But the uber-talented teams figure out a way to win when they're not. The Vikes are not in the latter category, and may have reached the point where we couldn't even win if we were exceptionally healthy.