Chiefs post game

[Cliff]

My biggest problem with the game? Our 3 ******* 1st round drafted CBs. It seems like Zimmer has the exact kind of toolbox he wants but when a team really attacks that secondary they crumble. Even to backup QBs. Though I will say that the defenders had great coverage in many situations and the play got made anyway. Other times they just got burned. I'm tired of hearing about how great this defense supposedly is at this point.

Missing an extra point is frustrating but par for the course.

Kirk Cousins stats for the last two drives after the game was tied: 1/4 for -7 yards. Kirk didn't have a bad game overall but he failed to come through at a crucial moment - again. He made weird decisions and bad passes. This is the kind of thing that contributes to the bad record against "teams that finish the season with a winning record" stat. Those games are often close and require a QB to play at their peak at the end. Kirk doesn't finish strong unless the other team is in prevent. Kirk isn't the reason they lost the game overall - he just wasn't able to be the reason they won it and he had the chance to be.

Honestly this loss just fits in with what I expect from the 2019 Vikings which is that they can't beat the better teams in the league. I expect 3 more losses this season. DAL, SEA, and GB - basically the good teams left on the schedule. The best team the Vikings beat were the Eagles and their defense was decimated when they played - when healthy they're only a bit above average. Otherwise we beat some middle-of-the-pack teams (OAK, DET) and some of the worst teams in the league (ATL, NYG, WAS).

I expected this game to be a win since they were missing one of the best QBs in the league and the defense was up against a QB that was coaching high school football a few months ago (if memory serves). Perhaps that's why I'm disappointed even though I thought this would be a loss earlier in the season.

[Tark]

Prove me wrong.

I mean he did beat Philly this year and they are a winning team. As for KC, he was the only reason we were in that game. I dont know how else I can prove you wrong when it comes to which future games we win/lose until those games are actually played....

I hope the team "proves me wrong" by winning some of the games I mentioned above. That's all I meant. I agree that Cousins played well enough to win in KC, it was the D that let us down when it counted but his record under certain circumstances do not look good.

[Tark]

Prove me wrong.

Why?

Why should anybody bother to prove you wrong?

News flash. Nobody cares.

Not saying anyone does, just looking for Cousins to "prove me wrong" by bucking a trend and winning some games under certain circumstances, that is all. Calm yourself....

[VikeFanInEagleLand]

Prove me wrong.

I mean he did beat Philly this year and they are a winning team. As for KC, he was the only reason we were in that game. I dont know how else I can prove you wrong when it comes to which future games we win/lose until those games are actually played....

C'mon! You've said it more than once that "he's the only reason we were in this game". One of the primary jobs of a QB is to throw the ball. There has to be someone on the other end to catch the ball, and hopefully advance the ball. It takes the line to give him time to throw the ball. So he's not the only reason we were in the game.

Yes. He threw some nice passes in scoring situations. Great. But his job is to throw a catchable ball close to 100% of the time, the same as it is the receivers job to catch them close to 100% of the time. If Diggs catches 3 TD's but then drops 2 in the end zone that are right to him, can we say "yeah but he's the reason we were even in that game"? OR do we say "C'mon Diggs! You cost us the game by dropping two balls that were right to you!"

Like I said Cousins made some good throws, but for the life of me I don't get how sometimes an NFL QB can throw awful throws to wide open guys as much as he did in that game. And even the TD pass to Abdullah I thought he overthrew at first, but Abdullah went up and got it.

I get that you consider yourself Cousins Great Defender, but he only did what he's paid to do a little more than half the time in that game.

[StumpHunter]

My biggest problem with the game? Our 3 ******* 1st round drafted CBs. It seems like Zimmer has the exact kind of toolbox he wants but when a team really attacks that secondary they crumble. Even to backup QBs. Though I will say that the defenders had great coverage in many situations and the play got made anyway. Other times they just got burned. I'm tired of hearing about how great this defense supposedly is at this point.

Missing an extra point is frustrating but par for the course.

Kirk Cousins stats for the last two drives after the game was tied: 1/4 for -7 yards. Kirk didn't have a bad game overall but he failed to come through at a crucial moment - again. He made weird decisions and bad passes. This is the kind of thing that contributes to the bad record against "teams that finish the season with a winning record" stat. Those games are often close and require a QB to play at their peak at the end. Kirk doesn't finish strong unless the other team is in prevent. Kirk isn't the reason they lost the game overall - he just wasn't able to be the reason they won it and he had the chance to be.

Honestly this loss just fits in with what I expect from the 2019 Vikings which is that they can't beat the better teams in the league. I expect 3 more losses this season. DAL, SEA, and GB - basically the good teams left on the schedule. The best team the Vikings beat were the Eagles and their defense was decimated when they played - when healthy they're only a bit above average. Otherwise we beat some middle-of-the-pack teams (OAK, DET) and some of the worst teams in the league (ATL, NYG, WAS).

I expected this game to be a win since they were missing one of the best QBs in the league and the defense was up against a QB that was coaching high school football a few months ago (if memory serves). Perhaps that's why I'm disappointed even though I thought this would be a loss earlier in the season.

Rhodes played poorly in that game?

Seemed to me that Hughes, Mac and Waynes were targeted the entire game and Rhodes had 1, possibly 2 completions on him(with the big one requiring a 1 handed spectacular catch) and had a pass breakup.

Moore is a backup QB, but he didn't play like one in this game. He didn't make mistakes and got rid of the ball very quickly, limiting our pass rush. The guy put 3 or 4 passes downfield that were just perfect placement, a couple as he was being hit. Better coverage on some of those passes would certainly have helped, and Waynes was pretty bad Sunday, but there was also an element of a great throw and catch that can be un-defendable at times.

I am with you on how the rest of the season will go. Do you think 10-6 and one and done is a good thing for this team or would you prefer 9-7, 8-8? Seems like an obvious answer, but 10-6 probably results in no changes, while missing the playoffs might light a fire under Ziggy.

[Pondering Her Percy]

I mean he did beat Philly this year and they are a winning team. As for KC, he was the only reason we were in that game. I dont know how else I can prove you wrong when it comes to which future games we win/lose until those games are actually played....

I hope the team "proves me wrong" by winning some of the games I mentioned above. That's all I meant. I agree that Cousins played well enough to win in KC, it was the D that let us down when it counted but his record under certain circumstances do not look good.

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

[Pondering Her Percy]

I mean he did beat Philly this year and they are a winning team. As for KC, he was the only reason we were in that game. I dont know how else I can prove you wrong when it comes to which future games we win/lose until those games are actually played....

C'mon! You've said it more than once that "he's the only reason we were in this game". One of the primary jobs of a QB is to throw the ball. There has to be someone on the other end to catch the ball, and hopefully advance the ball. It takes the line to give him time to throw the ball. So he's not the only reason we were in the game.

Yes. He threw some nice passes in scoring situations. Great. But his job is to throw a catchable ball close to 100% of the time, the same as it is the receivers job to catch them close to 100% of the time. If Diggs catches 3 TD's but then drops 2 in the end zone that are right to him, can we say "yeah but he's the reason we were even in that game"? OR do we say "C'mon Diggs! You cost us the game by dropping two balls that were right to you!"

Like I said Cousins made some good throws, but for the life of me I don't get how sometimes an NFL QB can throw awful throws to wide open guys as much as he did in that game. And even the TD pass to Abdullah I thought he overthrew at first, but Abdullah went up and got it.

I get that you consider yourself Cousins Great Defender, but he only did what he's paid to do a little more than half the time in that game.

Cousins threw 3 TDs passes in clutch situations. When was the D ever clutch? When was Cook/OL ever clutch that game? I'm well aware of his overthrows and he was definitely inaccurate. He could have played better 100% but he was why we scored on those drives. If it wasnt for him, there would only be a FG or no points. Imagine if we didnt throw those TDs and threw incomplete, turned it over or took a sack? Guys would be going off on here. He does what he's paid to do and throws 3 TDs at crucial times. Point is, he is not why we lost this game, nor did I think he really held us back this game. He had an average game. But an average game from a QB shouldnt result in a loss necessarily. Nobody else stepped up. Especially the defense. KC's defense stepped up. Ours did not.

[Tark]

I hope the team "proves me wrong" by winning some of the games I mentioned above. That's all I meant. I agree that Cousins played well enough to win in KC, it was the D that let us down when it counted but his record under certain circumstances do not look good.

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

Good point, hope the D steps up over the next few weeks but I'm not too optimistic.

[Dames]

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

I think the stupid record vs winning teams stat is so overstated... it's a team stat that is being attributed to one player. Confirmation bias at it's finest.

That said, it's maybe fair to say that Cousins doesn't have a very good track record as being the guy to pull off a miracle or carry the team in the clutch. Specifically looking at his track record with the Vikings, he hasn't exactly come through often in the clutch. (GB last year is one example, but it still ended in a tie.) He can make some great plays, absolutely, and his stats for the games are often excellent. But, with the game on the line, I'm not sure anyone really has the confidence that he'll put us a position to win. I'll hope for it every time of course, and often times it's not his fault that it doesn't work out. But, when you bring in a guy like this to lead your team, we all expect a bit more sometimes. That's not unreasonable, and it comes with the territory.

To be fair though, there are not many QB's in the league that truly offer this element of the game, and it's not like they have a 100% success rate doing it.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

Good point, hope the D steps up over the next few weeks but I'm not too optimistic.

Just to put that 31.8 points allowed into perspective, the Dolphins are the only team in the NFL currently that give up more than 31.8 points per game. They give up 32 even. So just slightly above what Cousins' defenses have given up in prime time. THAT's how bad his defense have been in prime time.

So when it comes to the "prime time record" stat for Cousins, I dont buy it one bit after seeing those numbers. It's just not a fair judgement if you ask me but many wont ever look at it that way. I'm glad to see Brandt did the research on it.

[Dames]

Cousins threw 3 TDs passes in clutch situations. When was the D ever clutch? When was Cook/OL ever clutch that game? I'm well aware of his overthrows and he was definitely inaccurate. He could have played better 100% but he was why we scored on those drives. If it wasnt for him, there would only be a FG or no points. Imagine if we didnt throw those TDs and threw incomplete, turned it over or took a sack? Guys would be going off on here. He does what he's paid to do and throws 3 TDs at crucial times. Point is, he is not why we lost this game, nor did I think he really held us back this game. He had an average game. But an average game from a QB shouldnt result in a loss necessarily. Nobody else stepped up. Especially the defense. KC's defense stepped up. Ours did not.

He really did put together 3 nice drives to take the lead back each time. But, there are always the glaring 2 drives at the end that overshadow it. Yep, the D is at fault for giving up the leads... but sometimes we just want our QB to win it. Fair or not.

[Dames]

My biggest problem with the game? Our 3 ******* 1st round drafted CBs. It seems like Zimmer has the exact kind of toolbox he wants but when a team really attacks that secondary they crumble. Even to backup QBs. Though I will say that the defenders had great coverage in many situations and the play got made anyway. Other times they just got burned. I'm tired of hearing about how great this defense supposedly is at this point.

The secondary is a liability lately. I hope it's just technique/scheme and that they can turn it around. Defenses can slump, and it's better now than at the end of the year. At least, we hope they have it figured it by then.

[StumpHunter]

I hope the team "proves me wrong" by winning some of the games I mentioned above. That's all I meant. I agree that Cousins played well enough to win in KC, it was the D that let us down when it counted but his record under certain circumstances do not look good.

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

Cousins is always the victim. Guy just can't catch a break.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Agreed that his record doesnt look good but Kyle Brandt said on Good Morning Football a week ago that everyone will bring up Kirks record in prime time and so on. But what nobody will talk about (and Brandt did this research) is that Kirk Cousins actually has more yards, better completion percentage, less turnovers, etc. in prime time games than he does in your normal day games. AND he said the biggest kicker, is that in those prime time games where Cousins "doesnt have a good record", his defense has given up on AVERAGE, 31.8 points per game. So the question is, has Kirk really been the problem in prime time?? By the sounds of it, no. I'm sure he's had some bad games like any QB, but it almost sounds like Cousins was the victim of bad defensive play more than anything.

I think the stupid record vs winning teams stat is so overstated... it's a team stat that is being attributed to one player. Confirmation bias at it's finest.

That said, it's maybe fair to say that Cousins doesn't have a very good track record as being the guy to pull off a miracle or carry the team in the clutch. Specifically looking at his track record with the Vikings, he hasn't exactly come through often in the clutch. (GB last year is one example, but it still ended in a tie.) He can make some great plays, absolutely, and his stats for the games are often excellent. But, with the game on the line, I'm not sure anyone really has the confidence that he'll put us a position to win. I'll hope for it every time of course, and often times it's not his fault that it doesn't work out. But, when you bring in a guy like this to lead your team, we all expect a bit more sometimes. That's not unreasonable, and it comes with the territory.

To be fair though, there are not many QB's in the league that truly offer this element of the game, and it's not like they have a 100% success rate doing it.

Very well said regarding the record stat Dames

To me, Cousins proved something to me against KC. Even though he was inaccurate more than usual and pressure was often in his face, the run game not working, defense not stepping up, etc, he didnt let it ruin his game. He didnt let it get to him and crumble under pressure. He actually responded fairly well in pressure situations. Like throwing a TD pass on 3rd down in the redzone when we need a TD. Continuing to fire back every time KC took a lead. That showed me something. Maybe not others but I was glad to see him go toe to toe when everything around him was crapping the bed. Unfortunately we came up short.

[fiestavike]

Cousins threw 3 TDs passes in clutch situations. When was the D ever clutch? When was Cook/OL ever clutch that game? I'm well aware of his overthrows and he was definitely inaccurate. He could have played better 100% but he was why we scored on those drives. If it wasnt for him, there would only be a FG or no points. Imagine if we didnt throw those TDs and threw incomplete, turned it over or took a sack? Guys would be going off on here. He does what he's paid to do and throws 3 TDs at crucial times. Point is, he is not why we lost this game, nor did I think he really held us back this game. He had an average game. But an average game from a QB shouldnt result in a loss necessarily. Nobody else stepped up. Especially the defense. KC's defense stepped up. Ours did not.

He really did put together 3 nice drives to take the lead back each time. But, there are always the glaring 2 drives at the end that overshadow it. Yep, the D is at fault for giving up the leads... but sometimes we just want our QB to win it. Fair or not.

If he played competently (hit open receivers, deliver the ball on time, not slide before the sticks, etc) there are probably two to three fewer possessions for the opposition offense and likely more points scored by our offense.