Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

A forum for the hard core Minnesota Vikings fan. Discuss upcoming games, opponents, trades, draft or what ever is on the minds of Viking fans!

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
Laserman
Hall of Famer
Posts: 7354
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:13 am
Location: Ft Walton Beach, Florida
x 13

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Laserman »

I have high hopes for Zimmer. Greene was pretty good Coach. Grant was by far our best coach but I'm a bit reluctant to put a "great" tag on Grant. He was outcoached in his first three superbowls. We could have won any one of those but we got outcoached. We were outcoached but also outplayed against the raiders and really didn't have a shot at that game, but with a smarter more prepared head coach or one who could realize his game plan mistakes in time and make adjustments and we could have beat the chiefs, steelers and dolphins. 4 superbowls and no wins but a great coach?
User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 38292
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL
x 409

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Mothman »

Laserman wrote:I have high hopes for Zimmer. Greene was pretty good Coach. Grant was by far our best coach but I'm a bit reluctant to put a "great" tag on Grant. He was outcoached in his first three superbowls. We could have won any one of those but we got outcoached. We were outcoached but also outplayed against the raiders and really didn't have a shot at that game, but with a smarter more prepared head coach or one who could realize his game plan mistakes in time and make adjustments and we could have beat the chiefs, steelers and dolphins. 4 superbowls and no wins but a great coach?
Mediocre coaches don't get to 4 Super Bowls in less than a decade and Grant lost to Stram, Shula, Noll and Madden. To put it another way: there are 22 coaches in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Grant's Vikes lost Super Bowls to 4 of them.

I think the only one of those Super Bowls where he was truly out-coached was the first one. In the others, I think the Vikes were just outplayed (and in the loss to the Steelers, not by much). YMMV.
Demi
Commissioner
Posts: 23785
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2004 4:24 pm
x 8

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Demi »

I think the only one of those Super Bowls where he was truly out-coached was the first one. In the others, I think the Vikes were just outplayed
They lacked the most important position on the field, by far. The quarterback. And despite a historical "Purple People Eaters" defense, they paid for it. Your QBs can't choke and expect to win. If only they had better play by their QBs!

4 super bowls

Starting QBs in all four combined for 1 passing touchdown.

:nono:

:twisted:
User avatar
Texas Vike
Hall of Fame Inductee
Posts: 4672
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:52 am
x 405

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Texas Vike »

Eli wrote: It will be minimal, unless you're talking about the moral support of cheering, same as found at a little league game. The noise-so-loud-you-can't-hear-the-QB is a much more recent phenomenon limited to indoor football stadiums. Seems highly unlikely to me that opposing offenses are going to be rattled much by 52,000 fans in a completely open bowl. Even indoors, the design of the stadium plays a huge factor in how loud the crowd can get.

http://keepingscore.blogs.time.com/2013 ... darn-loud/

Seen any Seahawks games? Outdoors, very loud, and very influential.
Eli
Hall of Famer
Posts: 7946
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2004 5:52 pm

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Eli »

Texas Vike wrote:Seen any Seahawks games? Outdoors, very loud, and very influential.
Let's call it an indoor/outdoor stadium. The design of the roof over the crowd is the reason it's so loud.
Demi
Commissioner
Posts: 23785
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2004 4:24 pm
x 8

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Demi »

Eli wrote: Let's call it an indoor/outdoor stadium. The design of the roof over the crowd is the reason it's so loud.
I heard it was the cloud cover. :lol:
dead_poet
Commissioner
Posts: 24788
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2007 2:30 pm
Location: Des Moines, Iowa
x 108

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by dead_poet »

Wasn't sure where to put this, but it should make some people happy.
How Jasper Brinkley described diff. defenses: "Before we were predominantly cover-2, now it's more than cover-2, it's multiple defenses."
@Andrew_Krammer on Twitter
“Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I assure you, it's much more serious than that.” --- Bill Shankly
King James
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1736
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:23 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by King James »

Laserman wrote:I have high hopes for Zimmer. Greene was pretty good Coach. Grant was by far our best coach but I'm a bit reluctant to put a "great" tag on Grant. He was outcoached in his first three superbowls. We could have won any one of those but we got outcoached. We were outcoached but also outplayed against the raiders and really didn't have a shot at that game, but with a smarter more prepared head coach or one who could realize his game plan mistakes in time and make adjustments and we could have beat the chiefs, steelers and dolphins. 4 superbowls and no wins but a great coach?

Of course most Vikings fans will label him as great because of the mere fact he's the only coach to get us close to a super bowl trophy. I have to agree with your post, I wouldn't call Grant great either. Well if we are talking about Vikings coaches, I would call him the greatest Vikings coach we had thus far. As for great NFL coach, I don't know. Like you said, Grant was really good but got out coached in the big games.
User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 38292
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL
x 409

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Mothman »

King James wrote:Of course most Vikings fans will label him as great because of the mere fact he's the only coach to get us close to a super bowl trophy. I have to agree with your post, I wouldn't call Grant great either. Well if we are talking about Vikings coaches, I would call him the greatest Vikings coach we had thus far. As for great NFL coach, I don't know. Like you said, Grant was really good but got out coached in the big games.
You know, he and his teams had to win 4 big games just to get to those Super Bowls.

Sometimes losing just means the other team was better, not that the coach of the losing team was out-coached. Stram out-coached Grant in Super Bowl IV. beyond that, I think the Vikes just lost the other 3 to better teams.
King James
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1736
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:23 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by King James »

Mothman wrote:
You know, he and his teams had to win 4 big games just to get to those Super Bowls.
Goodness!!!! :shock: I thought teams were just randomly picked to go to the super bowl all this time. :roll:


Sometimes losing just means the other team was better, not that the coach of the losing team was out-coached. Stram out-coached Grant in Super Bowl IV. beyond that, I think the Vikes just lost the other 3 to better teams.
I understand what you're saying. You think it was the team's fault more so than Bud Grant's fault himself. I am a firm believer that if the team loses to a "better" team then it's still the coaches fault as well as the players. After all those were his teams he prepared. Every super bowl we got our #### kicked like a government mule.

In all super bowls, we could not score until the second half. The first two we could not score until the 4th quarter. The first 3 we could not throw one passing TD.

While I do agree that teams do just end up losing to better teams. The stats from these super bowls show that we were simply out coached. Each team except Oakland had the same amount of wins as us. Oakland may have had a slightly better team than us.

I tell you one thing, in every super bowl, we did not play like the team who won 10-12+ games a season. Seems to me that Bud Grant was only good enough to get us to the big dance but not to win it.

As I said he is the great Vikings coach, by far the greatest we ever had. But only a good NFL head coach overall. Great NFL coaches don't lose every super bowl by blowouts. It's not the fact that we lost that bothers me, it's the margin of points we had compared to our opponents. The fact that we couldn't score until the 3rd-4th quarter. The fact that we could barely get the ball in the endzone. We were simply out coached and I hope this won't be the case for Mike Zimmer.
Purple bruise
Hall of Fame Candidate
Posts: 3565
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:55 pm

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Purple bruise »

King James wrote: Goodness!!!! :shock: I thought teams were just randomly picked to go to the super bowl all this time. :roll:


I understand what you're saying. You think it was the team's fault more so than Bud Grant's fault himself. I am a firm believer that if the team loses to a "better" team then it's still the coaches fault as well as the players. After all those were his teams he prepared. Every super bowl we got our #### kicked like a government mule.

In all super bowls, we could not score until the second half. The first two we could not score until the 4th quarter. The first 3 we could not throw one passing TD.

While I do agree that teams do just end up losing to better teams. The stats from these super bowls show that we were simply out coached. Each team except Oakland had the same amount of wins as us. Oakland may have had a slightly better team than us.

I tell you one thing, in every super bowl, we did not play like the team who won 10-12+ games a season. Seems to me that Bud Grant was only good enough to get us to the big dance but not to win it.

As I said he is the great Vikings coach, by far the greatest we ever had. But only a good NFL head coach overall. Great NFL coaches don't lose every super bowl by blowouts. It's not the fact that we lost that bothers me, it's the margin of points we had compared to our opponents. The fact that we couldn't score until the 3rd-4th quarter. The fact that we could barely get the ball in the endzone. We were simply out coached and I hope this won't be the case for Mike Zimmer.
You are aware that Grant was voted into the Hall of Fame right :shock: How did he manage to get voted in :?: 11 division championships and 4 Super Bowls!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TM2kgkTgmYk
Do not mistake KINDNESS for WEAKNESS!


Best to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool rather than open it and remove all doubt.
King James
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1736
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:23 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by King James »

Purple bruise wrote:
You are aware that Grant was voted into the Hall of Fame right :shock: How did he manage to get voted in :?: 11 division championships and 4 Super Bowls!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TM2kgkTgmYk
Ok. The HoF are elected by a select group of people. However their are still great people who have yet to be inducted. Grant deserved it though. He's the only coach who brought the best out of this team when they weren't playing for the super bowl. He's still not that great NFL coach in my opinion. Out of Vikings coaches yes, but not NFL coaches. The Pro Football HoF is a man made award, from a select group of gentleman, whose thought process we don't even know when they decide to elect players and coaches.

The super bowl losses is what defined his career to me. Good enough but couldn't cut the mustard when it really mattered. He and a few players have HoF rings but how many rings does the team have???????????????????????????????????????????????? That's right, nothing. Great coaches win championships, good coaches get there but lose. Yet if they have a lot of wins in their career, they get elected to the HoF.
Purple bruise
Hall of Fame Candidate
Posts: 3565
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:55 pm

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Purple bruise »

King James wrote: Ok. The HoF are elected by a select group of people. However their are still great people who have yet to be inducted. Grant deserved it though. He's the only coach who brought the best out of this team when they weren't playing for the super bowl. He's still not that great NFL coach in my opinion. Out of Vikings coaches yes, but not NFL coaches. The Pro Football HoF is a man made award, from a select group of gentleman, whose thought process we don't even know when they decide to elect players and coaches.

The super bowl losses is what defined his career to me. Good enough but couldn't cut the mustard when it really mattered. He and a few players have HoF rings but how many rings does the team have???????????????????????????????????????????????? That's right, nothing. Great coaches win championships, good coaches get there but lose. Yet if they have a lot of wins in their career, they get elected to the HoF.
Following your logic then if the Vikings do not go to or win a Super Bowl then AD should not be considered great :nono: should Page, Eller, Tarkenton etc. have been called great since they did not win a Super Bowl or just good. :confused: You crack me up King :wink:
Last edited by Purple bruise on Tue Apr 15, 2014 1:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Do not mistake KINDNESS for WEAKNESS!


Best to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool rather than open it and remove all doubt.
User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 38292
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL
x 409

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by Mothman »

King James wrote:Goodness!!!! :shock: I thought teams were just randomly picked to go to the super bowl all this time. :roll:

LOL! Hey, I'm not the one who said he got out-coached in the big games. :) I was just reminding you that his teams won some of those big games.
How, exactly, do the stats show that? You seem to believe losing = being out-coached, which is ridiculous.
Well, his teams certainly weren't good enough to win it. I see no reason why that's all on him.

By the way, were you even alive when the Vikings played in those Super Bowls?
King James
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1736
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:23 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: Zimmer prepping for TCF Bank Stadium

Post by King James »

Purple bruise wrote: Following your logic then if the Vikings do not go to or win a Super Bowl then AD should not be considered great :nono: should Page, Eller, Tarkenton etc. have been called great since they did not win a Super Bowl or just good. :confused: You crack me up King :wink:
I said nothing about players. It takes more than a few great players to win a super bowl. It takes a team to win championships. This is about Bug Grant being a great NFL coach. Nice try though.
Post Reply