2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

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headless_norseman
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by headless_norseman »

HardcoreVikesFan wrote:
So, just because a guy refuses to take a massive pay cut to play one more season in which a serious injury could occur he suddenly doesn't love the game? What indication in the last twelve seasons that he has been a Viking has made you come to that conclusion? Kevin was nothing short of a great teammate and classy player during his tenure here.

I have a hard time believing that if you were in Kevin's shoes you would take a massive pay cut to play one more season. I don't blame him one bit for trying to make as much money as possible. I don't blame him for deciding that one more year with a reduced salary may not be worth it. Seattle is not guaranteed a Super Bowl title. The Giants are long-shots for a Super Bowl title this season. The guy wants fair compensation, but it sounds like he is ready to retire as well. I wish him nothing but the best regardless of what choice he pursues.


Well put. :thumbsup:
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by mmvikes »

HardcoreVikesFan wrote: So, just because a guy refuses to take a massive pay cut to play one more season in which a serious injury could occur he suddenly doesn't love the game? What indication in the last twelve seasons that he has been a Viking has made you come to that conclusion? Kevin was nothing short of a great teammate and classy player during his tenure here.

I have a hard time believing that if you were in Kevin's shoes you would take a massive pay cut to play one more season. I don't blame him one bit for trying to make as much money as possible. I don't blame him for deciding that one more year with a reduced salary may not be worth it. Seattle is not guaranteed a Super Bowl title. The Giants are long-shots for a Super Bowl title this season. The guy wants fair compensation, but it sounds like he is ready to retire as well. I wish him nothing but the best regardless of what choice he pursues.
Well stated. Nice post
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by King James »

Funkytown wrote:Joe Webb confirmed the Panthers are using him as a quarterback.

Webb spent last season as a seldom-used wide receiver for the Vikings, catching five passes for 33 yards. Now in Carolina, he's sharing spring reps with Derek Anderson as Cam Newton rehabs from ankle surgery. They could end up battling for one roster spot at training camp.

Source: Charlotte Observer
--

Good luck, Mr.
Interesting. I wonder what they see in Webb that makes them believe he could potentially be a good back-up?
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by John_Viveiros »

King James wrote: Interesting. I wonder what they see in Webb that makes them believe he could potentially be a good back-up?
I think his record as a backup is fabulous. You just don't want him starting in the playoffs. At least, with an unimaginative coach.
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Mothman »

John_Viveiros wrote:think his record as a backup is fabulous. You just don't want him starting in the playoffs. At least, with an unimaginative coach.
Fabulous?! :shock:

I know you like Webb but that's so far from an accurate description of Webb's play it's not even a stretch. His stats certainly aren't fabulous. His record as a starter is 1-3 so that doesn't qualify either. Not only do you not want him starting in the playoffs, I don't think you want him starting at all, especially if the other team knows he'll be playing, keep him in the pocket and the game is as good as won. Let's face it, as a quarterback, Webb makes a good running back.

On top of all that, blaming his lousy playoff performance on the coaching is just passing the buck. He was bad in that game and he was bad at the #1 thing a QB needs to do well: pass the ball. He completed less than 37% of his passes and we're supposed to believe that was just due to a lack of imagination? Is he a quarterback or not?
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by King James »

Webb had that one great game against the Eagles a few years ago. Other than that, I haven't seen much to convince he will be a good QB period in his league. He's very dangerous when he scrambles out of the pocket but once you contain him, he's not going to beat you with his arm.

But like I said, It will be interesting to see what Carolina can get out of him or if they can bring something out of Webb that we couldn't do here.
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Webbfann »

King James wrote: Interesting. I wonder what they see in Webb that makes them believe he could potentially be a good back-up?
December 24, 2011

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24134&start=220
Mothman wrote:Webb's definitely making a case for himself in his appearances this season. they'll have to give him a close look in the offseason ...
PurpleKoolaid wrote:Looks like Webb is working himself into a starting QB job.
FailedtoOpen wrote: If Webb was a run first QB I'd say he would be ineffective. However he is developing as a passer and Cam is lighting up the league using the option offense.
When was the last time anyone said Ponder was developing something?
PurpleKoolaid wrote: I guess we know how to win, take out Ponder.
mondry wrote: Well it's clear at this point that Webb is the best QB we've had all along. Really makes me mad actually that we didn't just let Webb start this season as the "veteran qb" but you know what they say about hindsight. The only thing Ponder has going for him over Webb right now imo is that he was the #12 draft pick.


And 2 full seasons later we still have people wanting more of Ponder, and bashing Webb for one ill-prepared playoff game under Larry and Moe
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Mothman »

Webbfann wrote:And 2 full seasons later we still have people wanting more of Ponder, and bashing Webb for one ill-prepared playoff game under Larry and Moe
...and who are these people? Stop playing passive/aggressive games and speak your mind.

I'm not "bashing Webb for one ill-prepared playoff game under Larry and Moe". I'm calling that performance what it was: bad. It was bad by any standard. I'd say the same about any Vikings QB. Bad is bad and when a QB completes less than 37% of his passes, that's bad.

Webb's had his good moments, primarily when he's come on in relief, but overall, he simply hasn't played very well, especially as a starter. It's reflected in his stats and in his record.

As for Ponder... I know that's bait you're throwing out but I'm tired enough of it that I'll say this and please, pay attention and let... it... sink... in... :

I'm not calling for more of Ponder. I don't want to see him start another game for the Vikings unless he plays well enough to convince his new coaches he deserves to play and even then, I don't want to see him play unless, if he is actually given that opportunity, he plays well. My hopes for the Vikings future at the position don't lie with Ponder or Cassel, they lie with the draft.

I can't say it any more clearly than that.
Last edited by Mothman on Mon May 05, 2014 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Mothman »

fiestavike wrote:So...what you are saying is that you like Ponder and you want him to start? Apologist!
Exactly! :rofl:
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Webbfann »

Mothman wrote: ...and who are these people? Stop playing passive/aggressive games and speak your mind.

I'm not "bashing Webb for one ill-prepared playoff game under Larry and Moe". I'm calling that performance what it was: bad. It was bad by any standard. I'd say the same about any Vikings QB. Bad is bad and when a QB completes less than 37% of his passes, that's bad.

Webb's had his good moments, primarily when he's come on in relief, but overall, he simply hasn't played very well, especially as a starter. It's reflected in his stats and in his record.

As for Ponder... I know that's bait you're throwing out but I'm tired enough of it that I'll say this and please, pay attention and let... it... sink... in... :

I'm not calling for more of Ponder. I don't want to see him start another game for the Vikings unless he plays well enough to convince his new coaches he deserves to play and even then, I don't want to see him play unless, if he is actually given that opportunity, he plays well. My hopes for the Vikings future at the position don't lie with Ponder or Cassel, they lie with the draft.

I can't say it any more clearly than that.
I wasn't particularly thinking about you in my Ponder comment, plenty of others have carried that torch lately. But thanks for clarifying that you still want him to start. :lol:
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by headless_norseman »

Mothman wrote: On top of all that, blaming his lousy playoff performance on the coaching is just passing the buck. He was bad in that game and he was bad at the #1 thing a QB needs to do well: pass the ball. He completed less than 37% of his passes and we're supposed to believe that was just due to a lack of imagination? Is he a quarterback or not?

He was told like an hour beforehand that he was starting, wasn't he?
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Webbfann »

Mothman wrote: Fabulous?! :shock:

I know you like Webb but that's so far from an accurate description of Webb's play it's not even a stretch. His stats certainly aren't fabulous. His record as a starter is 1-3 so that doesn't qualify either. Not only do you not want him starting in the playoffs, I don't think you want him starting at all, especially if the other team knows he'll be playing, keep him in the pocket and the game is as good as won. Let's face it, as a quarterback, Webb makes a good running back.

On top of all that, blaming his lousy playoff performance on the coaching is just passing the buck. He was bad in that game and he was bad at the #1 thing a QB needs to do well: pass the ball. He completed less than 37% of his passes and we're supposed to believe that was just due to a lack of imagination? Is he a quarterback or not?
So a QB with 4 starts and one win and some obviously very good backup performances (and some not as good) has proved he shouldn't ever start, while a QB with 30 starts who has rarely shown any potential to be anything but sub-average outside of one 4 game stretch still deserves a shot? Why does one deserve waaaay more chances than the other?

Of course the coaches deserve the lions share of blame, they failed to call plays that could use his strengths. I'm sure webb would be the first to admit he didn't play well either. But if that was reason to bench him forever, so are Ponder's multiple sub 100 yard games. Now if Ponder only got 15 starts to prove himself and they also gave Webb at least 10, I wouldn't complain. But 4 starts? That's crazy.
As one person said during that skins game, he is obviously the better of the two.
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Eli »

Seriously? A Joe Webb debate? :lol:
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Webbfann »

Sure beats Ponder debates.
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Re: 2014 Free Agent Tracker & Discussion

Post by Mothman »

headless_norseman wrote:He was told like an hour beforehand that he was starting, wasn't he?
He knew it was a possibility all week and he practiced knowing that Ponder might not be able to go. As a backup QB, it was his job to be ready to play even if he only had a minute's notice. That's how the position works but in that case, he actually had more preparation than that. Finding out he was going to start at game time isn't an excuse for poor play.
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